Walk cycle from any angle - by cheating

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fiziwig
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Walk cycle from any angle - by cheating

Post by fiziwig » Sun Feb 10, 2008 9:48 pm

I was trying to work out a walk cycle in 3/4 view, when it suddenly occurred to me. I still have Poser 4 laying around from long ago, so I built a Poser "bones only" figure with the same proportions as my 2D toon character, and worked out the walk cycle in Poser. Now I can set my view angle in Poser, and export 1 cycle of walk as an AVI and use it as a reference layer in AS to move and scale the bones so they have proper perspective and foreshortening.

Heres my little Poser Bone Man: Notice the color coding so I can always tell right leg from left leg regardless of camera angle.

Image

So if you happen to have Poser (even a very old version of Poser), this is a handy way to make a perspective reference layer for posing bones.

--gary
rplate
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Re: Walk cycle from any angle - by cheating

Post by rplate » Sun Feb 10, 2008 10:54 pm

fiziwig wrote: So if you happen to have Poser (even a very old version of Poser), this is a handy way to make a perspective reference layer for posing bones.
--gary
So you call that CHEATING???
Well, here are walk cycles done in AS using Poser as a reference. I call it innovative and hard work and a lot of patience. CHEATING?? Who's cheating? :D
Here's the anime file if you want it.
download AS file
Its a full screen flash and is slow. I'll try and make smaller an... oh, never mind just download it and export it from AS as a swf or movie file.
.
Bob P :(
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fiziwig
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Post by fiziwig » Sun Feb 10, 2008 11:04 pm

Nice looking file. OK, so maybe not "cheating". :) :)

But a "real artist" is supposed to be able to do figure drawing in all sorts of poses. Me, I'm no real artist, so I cheat whenever possible.

--gary
rplate
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Re: Walk cycle from any angle - by cheating

Post by rplate » Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:21 am

fiziwig wrote:I was trying to work out a walk cycle in 3/4 view, when it suddenly occurred to me. I still have Poser 4 laying around from long ago, so I built a Poser "bones only" figure with the same proportions as my 2D toon character, and worked out the walk cycle in Poser.
Heres my little Poser Bone Man: Notice the color coding so I can always tell right leg from left leg regardless of camera angle.
Image
So if you happen to have Poser (even a very old version of Poser), this is a handy way to make a perspective reference layer for posing bones.

--gary
Gary, my question:
Do you import your little figure into AS as .obj files of the 8 frames of walk or are they a .mov file?
It just occurred to me that if they were 8 object files they could be rotated or sized as samples of any angle right in AS. Hmm... never thought about it till I asked?
I'll have to experiment. Could you post a download of your little Poser bone guy as a poser file. Pleeeze...
.
Bob P
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fiziwig
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Post by fiziwig » Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:38 am

I output an AVI file from Poser. My Poser 4 doesn't have MOV as an option.

I use AS basic, not AS Pro, so I can't import OBJ files anyway.

Here's the zipped pz3 file for the bone man. He's just the standard Poser 3 man with body parts replaced by "dumb bell" object I made in another 3D modeling ap.

Download PZ3 file Zipped

BTW: The walk cycle is 24 frames long.

Image

--gary
rplate
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Post by rplate » Mon Feb 11, 2008 1:10 am

Thanks Gary,
That will give me a chance to see if my idea might work. The walk cycles I did were rotoscopes from a Poser movie.

You're the best!
.
Bob P
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mkelley
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Post by mkelley » Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:47 am

Hey, even the great artists used models (and great animators often work with maquettes to see the various angles and scale issues). I've done what you're doing, only using 3D Max (my main 3D tool) to generate all kinds of walks, as well as rotoscoped human walks in 3D Max itself.

These things work well with my technique of using only four poses for a walk cycle.
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fiziwig
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Post by fiziwig » Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:24 am

mkelley wrote:Hey, even the great artists used models ...
Well, there's using a model, and then there's Maxfield Parrish. :wink:

If I was going to animate in Poser, I might as well just animate in Poser. But what I really have in mind is just using the "bones" model as a guide to placement and foreshortening. (in lieu of a trained eye.)

--gary
rplate
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Post by rplate » Mon Feb 11, 2008 5:25 am

fiziwig wrote: If I was going to animate in Poser, I might as well just animate in Poser. But what I really have in mind is just using the "bones" model as a guide to placement and foreshortening. (in lieu of a trained eye.)
--gary
EDIT:
Hey,
That idea of importing the 24 obj files of your bone man worked out great.
I also discovered you can import them into Anime Studio standard version.
I have both versions so I did some experimenting.
Here's what I found:
If I save an Anime file in the Pro version with 3d obj file and open it from within the standard version the 3d obj files load as 3d obj files. If you want to put your own obj files from a 3d progam into the standard version just rename YOUR files the same as the obj files in the folder. You will not get a 3D timeline though. Nor will you be able to rotate your obj layer except as it rotates inside the animation. But then again it's only a reference for position etc.
You can't add any more obj files than are already there. However you can delete some of the files and resave the Anime file with a new name. For example , If I only want five or even two I can delete all the ones I won't need and save that Anime file with two or five. Whatever. Just remember the object files must be in the folder with the Anime file.
.
See tutorial farther on in this thread. PAGE 2

Bob P
Last edited by rplate on Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:45 am, edited 3 times in total.
Genete
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Post by Genete » Mon Feb 11, 2008 7:04 am

Provide partial pieces of the Anime Studio Package (PRO) to non PRO users is close to the edge of illegality.

-G
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heyvern
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Post by heyvern » Mon Feb 11, 2008 2:13 pm

Genete, I don't think so really.

This falls into the same category as a "wax lock" and someone using a lighter to break it. Worse this is a tissue paper lock and someone spilled water on it and it fell off. ;)

The ability to so easily "break" the feature limitations with the standard version has always seemed silly to me. Utterly ridiculous and obviously something thrown in at the last minute. The feature limits make it "harder" to use those features but not impossible... not even hard at all. In fact you can override feature limits "by accident" in many cases.

They left that functionality in there to be used "by accident"? Seriously, these workarounds are so easy to find they don't fall into the category of violating the license in my opinion. (You can't discover serial numbers using sophisticated hacking tools "by accident". You don't give away your bank account information to just anyone who asks so don't give away your serial numbers either. ;) )

If someone can easily use those features by simply replacing files and folders this is not violating the licensing in my opinion. It would be like leaving a plate of cookies in front of hungry children and assuming they know not to eat them, and then walk away and leave them alone... if they eat the cookies... it doesn't make them bad children.

Now, if you throw the cookies away or lock them in a fire proof safe, and the children steal your car and your wallet and go BUY cookies... or use sophisticated safe cracking tools to pick the lock to get to the cookies, that's a horse of a different color. ;)

I have been over this in my head many times because the files I post with linked custom scripts open fine and work in the standard version. I could sell character files with custom scripts and bone rigs to ALL users of AS including standard. That isn't my fault.

-vern
Genete
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Post by Genete » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:12 pm

I can't believe it!

You should read the section 6 of the license.txt file provided with Anime Studio:
6. Content Distribution
A. As used in this section, the term "Restricted Content" means all files and data included with or part of the Program including but not limited to:
- Included files in all proprietary Program file formats (MOHO, ANME and any subsequent/compressed formats).
- Included images (including but not limited to materials, texture and transparency maps).
- Included documentation.
- Included scripts.
- Restricted Content extracted or exported from the Program remains Restricted Content except as expressly permitted by this agreement.

B. Third-party content included with Program and Documentation is copyrighted and owned by the original content creators.

C. The Company claims full ownership and copyright rights to all Company-created Restricted Content and all derivatives of these files which are not expressly permitted by this agreement.

D. You cannot sell, resell, distribute, cause to be distributed, or allow any portion of the Restricted Content to be distributed under any circumstances, via any public or private medium, except where expressly permitted by this EULA and US copyright law, without the Company's prior written consent, a copy of which must be furnished with all Restricted Content distributed in accordance with this section. You may only use the Restricted Content for exclusive use on one computer unless authorized within this EULA and/or the contents of the Company's official written consent.

E. You may copyright and distribute rendered still or animated images derived from the Restricted Content without restriction or royalty to Company provided you do not violate other clauses of this agreement.

F. If you purchased a Site License, you may distribute the Restricted Content between all computers containing valid copies of the Program, other Company products, and/or other software able to process Restricted Content.

G. You may use and distribute the Allowed Content in accordance with all applicable license terms imposed by the content's original creator. The Company does not enforce third-party rights.

H. The purpose of defining certain content as Restricted Content is to protect the Company's investment, interests, and ownership of Restricted Content. It is not the Company's policy to unreasonably restrict or inhibit any third party's creative or commercial activities. The following are Legitimate Uses of Restricted Content:
- Creating tutorials, books, or other educational materials using images of Program interface for sale, distribution, public display, etc., provided they are intended to educate users as to use of the Program, or when used under the "fair use" guidelines of US copyright law. Any other use of images of the Program interface must be approved by the Company's prior written consent.
- Creating original content for Restricted Content for sale, distribution, public display, etc.
- Creating materials for use with either Restricted or Allowed Content.
- Creating characters or props based on Restricted Content in proprietary file formats, where the original art, texture, or other Restricted Content Files are not distributed with said characters, props, scenes.

J. As part of the legitimate uses for Restricted Content outlined above, you may reproduce, distribute, sell, copyright, publicly display, and publicly perform using Restricted Content provided that such activity is limited to the Legitimate Uses enumerated above and does not violate any other clauses in this agreement and/or applicable US copyright laws.
So, if I find a car parked with the keys on and started I'm right taking it to me???? I call it theft.

I haven't any interest on defend Lost Marble, e-frontier or Smith Micro. They have their own lawyers. I only wanted to advise to rplate that in my opinion he is violating the license agreement.

Here we're not children. Each one know what he does.

-G
GardenGuy
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Post by GardenGuy » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:30 pm

So, the way I read the license, it would be okay to share a user created anme file that happens to have 3D obj in it. But not a file that came as content, just with the Pro version.

To take a script from Pro and share it is not okay. Sharing user created scripts, though, looks okay. (...and even seems to be encouraged by the creation of a script folder in the Standard installation, which is otherwise empty until you put a script in it).
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Mikdog
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Post by Mikdog » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:42 pm

They use this technique in ODDJOB JACK.
rplate
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Post by rplate » Mon Feb 11, 2008 4:55 pm

Genete wrote:I can't believe it!
You should read the section 6 of the license.txt file provided with Anime Studio:
E. You may copyright and distribute rendered still or animated images derived from the Restricted Content without restriction or royalty to Company provided you do not violate other clauses of this agreement.
.
So, if I find a car parked with the keys on and started I'm right taking it to me???? I call it theft.
-G
I used my own content in the files.
If you carry that logic to it's fullest, you could say that using a bone folder in the Standard version, as a group folder, is stealing as well.

My intent was not to be a thief but just excited to share a discovery. :(

I have to agree with GardenGuy.
Last edited by rplate on Wed Feb 13, 2008 6:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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