Fixed the tail, the feet sliding (as far as I can) and added shadows.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLBMOPaGtFw
Have anyone tryed synfig?
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DarthFurby
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Very nice cat animation Genete! You could've done that in Anime Studio too, but my favorite thing about Synfig is the way it implements point motion to create smooth complex morphs. I think it could be really easy to animate cloth with the folds appearing and disappearing, which is difficult to do in AS. This is how they were able to do those awesome prologue and werewolf clips.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9EDol07WLE
Initial attempt on create particles in Synfig. Notice how the particles can be mixed with other drawings. The text is crossing the particles smoothly.
Can you do that with Anime Studio?
Initial attempt on create particles in Synfig. Notice how the particles can be mixed with other drawings. The text is crossing the particles smoothly.
Can you do that with Anime Studio?
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DarthFurby
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Moving text through the clouds like that is possible in hi-end 3d programs like Maya, but I don't think you can even do that in After Effects without faking it, let alone Anime Studio. Not only is it depth sorting, but it's the first time I've ever seen a 3d particle system interact directly with other 3d layers in a "2d" program, and if the emitters and physics are sophisticated and keyframable then this is possibly the best particle system out there for a 2d animation program. But Synfig is really strange, you can move layers in z-depth space, but you can't rotate layers on the xyz axis. They really should make that a feature. Even so, I can't believe they finally added a particle system. This is easily the biggest Synfig update in years. Hopefully it's a sign that the developers will update more frequently, because a few more like that and I may have a new favorite animation program.
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toonertime
- Posts: 595
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- Location: ST. LOUIS
synfig question
hi genete
I always like reading what you are up to in animation!
Hey, I was looking at the synfig site and not being a
programmer, I am wondering how to download this
program and make it work on my windows.
It doesn't seem to be a simple download, but a group
of downloads. How does one put all this together
to try to sample synfig??
I thank you in advance!
I always like reading what you are up to in animation!
Hey, I was looking at the synfig site and not being a
programmer, I am wondering how to download this
program and make it work on my windows.
It doesn't seem to be a simple download, but a group
of downloads. How does one put all this together
to try to sample synfig??
I thank you in advance!
hi toonertime!
I'm not windows user so I have not test how to install synfig in a windows machine.
But according to the Download instructions you should load and install:
gtk
gtkmm
synfig
synfigstudio
all programs are required for a windows machine. All they are exe files. I guess that you should install them in that order because the one require the others.
Synfigstudio is the graphical user interface and needs synfig (the command line renderer) and gtk and gtkmm that are the libraries for the program interface widgets.
You can install them from the official release 0.61.07 of form the unofficial release (subversion) both located at the previous link. The only difference is that one is newer than the other and some recent changes are not updated yet to the official release.
This project needs a lot of support. But unfortunately there is only two or three developers. There is a windows package mantainer (who compiles and publish the releases regulary). Also there is a linux mantainer (for debian family distribution). I have my own compiled version at the last unofficial release (subversion). Compilation under linux is quite easy.
Regarding to the particles thing it is not a particular feature from synfig. It comes from a special combination of the current synfig tools and type conversion that have been introduced to the last subversion that allow to make that kind of particles thing. I'm working on them now. But you can do much more than those particles...
if you finally install it and want to play with it please visit http://wiki.synfig.com. You'll need to read the tutorials and the "How do I?" to enjoy the program.
Good luck
-G
I'm not windows user so I have not test how to install synfig in a windows machine.
But according to the Download instructions you should load and install:
gtk
gtkmm
synfig
synfigstudio
all programs are required for a windows machine. All they are exe files. I guess that you should install them in that order because the one require the others.
Synfigstudio is the graphical user interface and needs synfig (the command line renderer) and gtk and gtkmm that are the libraries for the program interface widgets.
You can install them from the official release 0.61.07 of form the unofficial release (subversion) both located at the previous link. The only difference is that one is newer than the other and some recent changes are not updated yet to the official release.
This project needs a lot of support. But unfortunately there is only two or three developers. There is a windows package mantainer (who compiles and publish the releases regulary). Also there is a linux mantainer (for debian family distribution). I have my own compiled version at the last unofficial release (subversion). Compilation under linux is quite easy.
Regarding to the particles thing it is not a particular feature from synfig. It comes from a special combination of the current synfig tools and type conversion that have been introduced to the last subversion that allow to make that kind of particles thing. I'm working on them now. But you can do much more than those particles...
if you finally install it and want to play with it please visit http://wiki.synfig.com. You'll need to read the tutorials and the "How do I?" to enjoy the program.
Good luck
-G
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toonertime
- Posts: 595
- Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:34 am
- Location: ST. LOUIS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpUBrWc36tQ
Now the particles can be free floating when source moves.
-G
Now the particles can be free floating when source moves.
-G
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DarthFurby
- Posts: 510
- Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2006 1:34 pm
- Location: New York City
- Contact:
Well, in fact particles is not a feature itself. It is an special combination of maths made by me what allows make particles simulations. The parameters are limited from the current Anime Studio one. For example I've not achieves properly the particles on/off thing. It works but not as I want. Also the particles follow path could be achievable but complicates too much the equations. What I was more concentrated was to achieve the free floating property (what works quite well. You can read the wiki page I've done to see what can be done.DarthFurby wrote:Genete how does Synfig's particle system compare with Anime Studio's? On the surface it looks like Synfig's is better, but I haven't had a chance to play with it yet. But I really like what I see.
http://Synfig.org/Particles
The coolest thing is that you can change the parameters during the animation (for example the angle or the shooting speed) what gives more flexibility for other uses.
Also the possibility of interact with the rest of the objects (for example you can link the gravity force angle with the angle of a shape) makes it so interesting.
-G
EDITED: A waterfall trial:
http://www.darthfurby.com/genete/synfig/waterfall.avi
Genete,
Since you apparently have some relationship with the developers, perhaps you could give them some feedback.
As others have said, one of the biggest limitations of the program is lack of bones. (I'll get to the second in a moment). While it's *possible* to do some bone-type animations in the program, bones are essentially the difference between someone with talent and someone without talent doing complicated animations. For example, I could (and did) do your cat animation in AS (because I was making a cat cartoon for my grandkids' Christmas) in about 5 minutes while it took you three hours -- and I have zero talent in that regard. It weren't me, it were the bones.
But the other critical issue, which you seem to dismiss, is the lack of audio and lip sync support. Animated cartoons (with rare exceptions) consists of about 95% lip sync -- watch any cartoon and you'll see there are only very small moments where characters aren't speaking. Papagayo in concert with AS handles this like a champ and it's done so well and so easily that I think many people kind of dismiss it (like anything that easy can't be hard to do otherwise).
I've been working with animation for 20 years or so now and I can tell you that accurate lip sync is both incredibly hard and critical to all animation projects. For that alone AS wins the prize -- I've never seen anything come close to it even in the 3D world (where I've spent thousands of dollars just for lip sync software). If you look at any cartoon credits you'll see there is always a lip sync team -- that's ALL they do, because it's both that hard and that critical.
If Synfig is going to be taken seriously as any kind of 2D animation program it needs to both support sound as well as offer some kind of lip sync facility, hopefully something at least that can take advantage of Papagayo (that would be the easy way out so they don't have to reinvent the wheel). It needs the sound on the timeline because you have to be able to make facial changes to match the audio -- that's also very very critical even with Papagayo as your core (I spend about 70% of the time in any animation on this, while the actual moving of limbs and other things is only about 30%).
The particle and morphing cloud stuff doesn't impress me, but that's because I come from a 3D background where we can do that kind of stuff in minutes (and much more impressive -- you should see the fire package I use, with effects like the Backdraft movie). But if they get bones and lipsync... well, I'll certainly be there to try it.
Since you apparently have some relationship with the developers, perhaps you could give them some feedback.
As others have said, one of the biggest limitations of the program is lack of bones. (I'll get to the second in a moment). While it's *possible* to do some bone-type animations in the program, bones are essentially the difference between someone with talent and someone without talent doing complicated animations. For example, I could (and did) do your cat animation in AS (because I was making a cat cartoon for my grandkids' Christmas) in about 5 minutes while it took you three hours -- and I have zero talent in that regard. It weren't me, it were the bones.
But the other critical issue, which you seem to dismiss, is the lack of audio and lip sync support. Animated cartoons (with rare exceptions) consists of about 95% lip sync -- watch any cartoon and you'll see there are only very small moments where characters aren't speaking. Papagayo in concert with AS handles this like a champ and it's done so well and so easily that I think many people kind of dismiss it (like anything that easy can't be hard to do otherwise).
I've been working with animation for 20 years or so now and I can tell you that accurate lip sync is both incredibly hard and critical to all animation projects. For that alone AS wins the prize -- I've never seen anything come close to it even in the 3D world (where I've spent thousands of dollars just for lip sync software). If you look at any cartoon credits you'll see there is always a lip sync team -- that's ALL they do, because it's both that hard and that critical.
If Synfig is going to be taken seriously as any kind of 2D animation program it needs to both support sound as well as offer some kind of lip sync facility, hopefully something at least that can take advantage of Papagayo (that would be the easy way out so they don't have to reinvent the wheel). It needs the sound on the timeline because you have to be able to make facial changes to match the audio -- that's also very very critical even with Papagayo as your core (I spend about 70% of the time in any animation on this, while the actual moving of limbs and other things is only about 30%).
The particle and morphing cloud stuff doesn't impress me, but that's because I come from a 3D background where we can do that kind of stuff in minutes (and much more impressive -- you should see the fire package I use, with effects like the Backdraft movie). But if they get bones and lipsync... well, I'll certainly be there to try it.
Such a statement is only understandable if your only source of animated films is the local TV program. The animation I see on festivals and in shortfilm programs is mostly completely without dialogue. And even commercial animation, like TV series, tries to hold the lipsinc part way under 50% of the total length.Animated cartoons (with rare exceptions) consists of about 95% lip sync
Perhaps it's a language/cultural thing here, ST, but when I say animated cartoons I thought I was pretty clearly referring to the cartoon SHOWS that are the mainstay of animation. I wouldn't call what you are talking about "cartoons" at least insofar as common usage here in the U.S.
There are as many ways to animate as there are to prepare food, and I am in no way denigrating other forms but they aren't mainstream and they aren't what the vast majority of people using these animated programs are trying to do. Just like you can make a full length movie without any dialog, the plain fact is that it's an exception rather than the rule. Animation without dialog certainly is done, but compared to the hundreds and thousands of hours of cartoon animation it only represents a drop in the bucket (a very tiny drop in a very large bucket at that).
And I'm not sure what commercial animation you are talking about, but here most lip sync animation is FAR more than 50% of screen time (about 95%, quite easily).
If Synfig is totally devoted to a small niche market then fine and good, but if it wants to be considered a program that will be used by the majority then it needs to address lip sync, plain and simple.
There are as many ways to animate as there are to prepare food, and I am in no way denigrating other forms but they aren't mainstream and they aren't what the vast majority of people using these animated programs are trying to do. Just like you can make a full length movie without any dialog, the plain fact is that it's an exception rather than the rule. Animation without dialog certainly is done, but compared to the hundreds and thousands of hours of cartoon animation it only represents a drop in the bucket (a very tiny drop in a very large bucket at that).
And I'm not sure what commercial animation you are talking about, but here most lip sync animation is FAR more than 50% of screen time (about 95%, quite easily).
If Synfig is totally devoted to a small niche market then fine and good, but if it wants to be considered a program that will be used by the majority then it needs to address lip sync, plain and simple.