Quill

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Quill

Postby chucky » Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:58 am



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Re: Quill

Postby jahnocli » Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:18 pm

This is obviously ground-breaking software. The guy describes these clips as "tutorials", but they aren't -- we're just watching him do stuff. He also has a really annoying voice; I know that's not his problem, but I can't listen to him for an hour at a time, so I skipped through a lot of what he was saying. Probably missed a lot of important bits. I would be interested in how much fine control is possible - he never touched on what you might call 'granularity'. In ten years' time we'll probably all be wearing headsets and swivelling our heads around like owls on speed...
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Mon Apr 23, 2018 4:02 pm

I've had a go with software like this , it's pretty amazing.
By granularity do you mean the screen door effect?
I think the hardware has to become much lighter and more importantly , have a much greater resolution.

There's another thing that's really happening other than the VR factor l think .
It's the "liveness" of the process ,. Painting the animation , this is like 3D performance capture.

Moho has potential to put a foot into this territory , but l won't go there again.
. . . . Too soon
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Re: Quill

Postby slowtiger » Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:28 am

All nice and shiny, but the whole VR hype doesn't address one general problem: ergonomics.

It looks great in any demo to spread out your hands like Mickey in Sorcerer's Apprentice to do stuff, but try to imagine to do this for 8 hrs a day. You can't, and you don't want to. You need a hand rest and arm rest for real work. Plus, only these give you a fixed support for more precise working.
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Tue Apr 24, 2018 10:00 am

That stuff is as easy to adjust as mouse sensitivity and a chair. Beats carpel tunnel syndrome.
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Re: Quill

Postby jahnocli » Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:16 am

chucky wrote:By granularity do you mean the screen door effect?...

No, I mean the fineness of detail. Everything we saw here was kind of splodgy...
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Re: Quill

Postby dkwroot » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:41 pm

This tech is developing quickly, I love it. It's still really gimmicky at this phase due to the clunky hardware, but imagine where this is going to be in 10 years. What really needs to be improved is the way we interact within the 3d space. The controllers need to go away and we need something like a pair of gloves. Imagine being able to put on gloves and have every finger perfectly tracked. You would be able to sculpt in 3d space as naturally as you would handle a real piece of clay.
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:44 pm

dkwroot wrote:This tech is developing quickly, I love it. It's still really gimmicky at this phase due to the clunky hardware, but imagine where this is going to be in 10 years. What really need to be improved is the way we interact within the 3d space. The controllers need to go away and we need something like a pair of gloves. Imagine being able to put on gloves and have every finger perfectly tracked. You would be able to sculpt in 3d space as naturally as you would handle a real piece of clay.

Yep, We might even be able to use a stylus which works as a brush and or sculpting tool . The environment can render various tips from scalpel to feather duster .
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Re: Quill

Postby dkwroot » Tue Apr 24, 2018 12:50 pm

As for the ergonomics, that's not an issue. The user could shrink any object down to something they can hold and sculpt in their hand. They could even select individual pieces and isolate those for working in greater detail.

For example, a user could sculpt a small tree in their hands. They could then project a copy of the tree in front of them and scale it up to the size of a real tree. The changes they make to the model in their hand would instantly update the big tree in front of them. This allows them to get a feel for the object in real scale. With small tree base model still in their hand, they could zoom in on even the smallest leafs and create fine details. These detail would instantly update the bigger model. They could do all of this while seated comfortably, as if they were just sculpting a small piece of clay in their hands.

What's really interesting is how this is going to affect group projects. Multiple artists could be working on a single model. They don't even have to be in the same room. So, while one artists adds details to the leafs of a tree, another is etching in details to the bark, while another is painting in texture. It's going to be crazy.

The current tech is still in early development. Give the software and hardware time to be refined.
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Tue Apr 24, 2018 2:04 pm

Exactly... forget being strapped to a keyboard and cintiq. Ergonomics will be minutely controllable you'll be able to make as big or small motions as you like . The virtual space is just that... virtual and infinitely configurable.. well within the range of whatever is comfortable.
Problem is , the people who work at home might find themselves back in a 'virtual' cubicle designed by office management.... :mrgreen: :mrgreen:
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Re: Quill

Postby slowtiger » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:16 pm

Scaling etc is all fine, but what these thingies lack is tactile feedback, and you will still not have any support for your outstretched arms or hands.

forget being strapped to a keyboard and cintiq.

You call 10.000 years of using a stylos or knife with a piece of wood or paper or clay in your lap or on your table or easel "being strapped to"?
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Tue Apr 24, 2018 4:41 pm

Well I've had some long shifts but....10,000 years , that's stamina. :mrgreen:
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Re: Quill

Postby slowtiger » Tue Apr 24, 2018 6:37 pm

:D
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Re: Quill

Postby funksmaname » Wed Apr 25, 2018 12:35 am

I have this software, and it's amazing... I've not really used it much to be honest, and not for prolonged periods (mainly just when showing how amazing it is to visitors :P so my examples below were all done in real time in about 3 minutes) - but where I really see potential for it in the short term is for prototyping and storyboarding VERY quickly and naturally.

For example, with the fbf tools, each layer has it's own 'length' of loop, so you're free to add elements at different loop lengths.
Also, you can draw freely WHILE it's looping - so in the example below, (this is kinda hard to explain, but hopefully it makes sense) if you freely flow your hand and draw the length of line is dictated by your speed as the frame goes past, and if you keep going over multiple cycles over and over but move your hand in a natural flow, you end up with a perfectly looping 'shape' that would be VERY hard to do in 3D. To clarify, over a 12 frame loop, you end up with each frame having lots of line segments, but they all flow perfectly when animating.

When exporting you SHOOT your animation with a virtual camera - you can rotate the scene, move and TRACK your head position while holding the trigger to capture frames. This means with a single scene layout you can export an endless variety of angles very quiclkly and see the exported timing and angles as video or gif which you could use as a guide for 'real' animation.

This is where I see the storyboarding/roughing strength - its FUN and DIFFERENT

Image
here's a stupid example but it shows how just 'shooting' different angles works.

Here is what things look like with onionskinning, while it's not playing... you are free to resize the environment as well as move your head or position:
Image

This is another rubbish test but shows the 'flowing' animation lines and changing angles on export.
Image

I just watched some of the video at the top and realised he shows this animation stuff much better when doing the leaves and water... but on a more abstract level, this method could allow you to plan flow and direction of animation by capturing your own acting, the tracking is fantastic in VR now, even if you only use a single line to plan the speed, spacial motion and then adapt the angle(s) of the motion for export as a motion guide for doing EVERYTHING else in moho/2D
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Re: Quill

Postby chucky » Wed Apr 25, 2018 3:49 am

Love those flowing lines.
:arrow: Drawing in 3D will be the new art form of the next decade.
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