As Pro 8 vs Toon Boom AP 2

A place to discuss non-Moho software for use in animation. Video editors, audio editors, 3D modelers, etc.

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Shepard
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Post by Shepard » Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:22 am

GCharb wrote:
Shepard wrote:1. I'm trying AS, and I'm watching (and following) this tutorial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMTo_DNWD9A

In 2:40, the guy makes the tongue, and it is behind the teeth, in the same level!
I try to do this, but tongue is in front of the teeth! Why? I do the same things!
It has to do with shape order, you just need to select the shape of the tongue with the shape select tool(Q), then go in the draw menu and click on raise shape, you may need to raise a few time.
I can't to do this.... I can't to draw some figures and "levels" them in priority clicking each of them...
What is "raise shape"?
crsP wrote: Look for selgins techniques for head turns. In the case of simulating head turns in AS, you need the characters constructed out of vectors. This is why importing from Photoshop wont work [or any other bitmap program].
I tried to do this, but doesn't work... I import a character, but bar tools show me only "special", ""layer", "camera" and "workspace"...
I can't to interact with the image in other way...
The image is in png format..
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jahnocli
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Post by jahnocli » Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:57 pm

Shepard wrote:The image is in png format..
OK. The png format is a bitmap format. You cannot use bitmap formats for these kind of head turns. Draw the shapes in Anime Studio...
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
Shepard
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Post by Shepard » Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:56 pm

But selgin said:
selgin wrote: It's important how fast you can rig and animate the character. For example, just yesterday I had to animate some scenes for an animatic:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/54411/videos/cu ... imatic.mov
Illustration were made by other guy in Photoshop (in AS8 you can import layered PSD files, so there is no need of having independent png files anymore). I imported that layered files and the rigging and animation took me around 15 minutes for each scene.
I don't know Toon Boom so much, but I really know the pros and limitations of AS and I'm certainly sure there isn't other software able to challenge that time.
I tried to import a psd file, but it's the same thing which happens with a .png file...

A similar question: how do for EXPORT a character (with all bones)?
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jahnocli
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Post by jahnocli » Mon Jul 04, 2011 10:15 pm

Selgin was at that time talking about something else. Now you are asking about exporting files! Concentrate on one thing at a time, or no-one will be able to help you...
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
Shepard
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Post by Shepard » Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:17 am

jahnocli wrote:Selgin was at that time talking about something else. Now you are asking about exporting files! Concentrate on one thing at a time, or no-one will be able to help you...
No. You're confusing.

Only a post ago I asked:
Shepard wrote:
A similar question: how do for EXPORT a character (with all bones)?
But is another situation, not yet discussed.

-----

When you responded to me:
jahnocli wrote:
Shepard wrote:The image is in png format..
OK. The png format is a bitmap format. You cannot use bitmap formats for these kind of head turns. Draw the shapes in Anime Studio...
the question was:
Shepard wrote:I import a character, but bar tools show me only "special", ""layer", "camera" and "workspace"...
I can't to interact with the image in other way...
The image is in png format..
IMPORT a character.

The principal situation is: when I import a character in .png format and/or .psd format, can I animate this? The selgin's responds is "yes", yours is "no".

What is the truth?

Because if I import a character from a psd or png format, I can't add new bones and I can't rig it.
Shepard wrote:
GCharb wrote:
Shepard wrote:1. I'm trying AS, and I'm watching (and following) this tutorial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMTo_DNWD9A

In 2:40, the guy makes the tongue, and it is behind the teeth, in the same level!
I try to do this, but tongue is in front of the teeth! Why? I do the same things!
It has to do with shape order, you just need to select the shape of the tongue with the shape select tool(Q), then go in the draw menu and click on raise shape, you may need to raise a few time.
I can't to do this.... I can't to draw some figures and "levels" them in priority clicking each of them...
What is "raise shape"?
I solved this problem. "Raise shape" is in the Draw menu, with "Lower" feature. Thanks.
ponysmasher
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Post by ponysmasher » Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:49 am

Shepard wrote: The principal situation is: when I import a character in .png format and/or .psd format, can I animate this? The selgin's responds is "yes", yours is "no".

What is the truth?
You can animate it but you can't do the kind of smooth head turns that you can do with characters you draw in anime studio.
Shepard wrote: Because if I import a character from a psd or png format, I can't add new bones and I can't rig it.
This should work. Is your character divided into several pieces? One layer for the head, at least one layer for an arm etc?
Shepard
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Post by Shepard » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:11 pm

Ok, I found this tutorial: http://my.smithmicro.com/tutorials/2306.html

It's perfect for my doubt!

Now, the second question: how I do to export a character maintaining all bones?
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Víctor Paredes
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Post by Víctor Paredes » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:15 pm

Shepard wrote:Now, the second question: how I do to export a character maintaining all bones?
You don't export a character. You import a character from an anme file in a new scene (which is the same, technically)
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Shepard
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Post by Shepard » Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:57 am

How can do this?

Of course, I speak about a my character, the same, not another new character.

Thanks.
ponysmasher
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Post by ponysmasher » Wed Jul 06, 2011 10:57 am

Shepard wrote:How can do this?

Of course, I speak about a my character, the same, not another new character.

Thanks.
Use File>Import>Anime Studio Object, and select the .anme file that has the character you want to import.
JaMike
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Re: As Pro 8 vs Toon Boom AP 2

Post by JaMike » Sun Jul 17, 2011 3:41 pm

Shepard wrote:for this summer I will divert with cartoon animation in South Park's style.

Which software is more indicate for me? AS Pro 8 or Toon Boom AP 2?
Okay, I haven't used ASP 8 yet, but for South Park type animation, Toon Boom AP 2 is too cumbersome - it's just not designed for that sort of thing.

I did try the ASP 7 demo, and that was much better for South Park style.

As long as they didn't take anything out of ASP 8, it will still be more suitable than Animate Pro 2.
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Post by Matsuemon » Tue Jul 19, 2011 7:05 pm

GCharb wrote:Easy, if you are looking for a frame by frame animation software, then Toonboom is what you need, with it you get better drawing tools, better colour registration, you get a node based compositor with advanced effects and compositor, better content management, better 3d environment, better timeline tools, better morphing tools.

It is also much pricier, rigging can be quite tedious, no bones, limited scripting, much less scripts/plug-ins available, community much less active, takes much more time to do anything, slower at render, I find render quality of less quality then ASP, much more complicated to use, no character wizard(LOL).

ASP on the other hand is much cheaper, has bones, easier to set-up a character, you can do much more with it then the manual or basic functions lead you to believe, fast render, works well with Photoshop, image warp, tons of available scripts, huge and very active community, sometimes you get users to actually create or modify an existing script to specific needs or to resolve bugs, you get to communicate with the head programmer, and much more.

If you are looking for something that will allow you to make pro grade animation on a budget and fast, if you do not need frame by frame animation, then ASP is the way to go!
Actually GC, the new version of TBS does indeed have bones now. It still doesn't allow you to adjust points the way AS does, and for some that is a huge selling point for AS.
crsP
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Post by crsP » Wed Jul 20, 2011 10:29 am

Yes, Toon Boom Studio has FK bones, but this thread is discussing Toon Boom Animate. And I think GCharb is correct that this product has no bones currently.
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GCharb
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Post by GCharb » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:48 pm

Nope, TBAP 2 has no bones, they are announced in V3 though, but from what I got from Lilly on their forum, they will not be as useful as ASP bones, since you wont be able to scale them etc.

One piece of software I would like to have a look at is the next release of harmony standalone, which should sale around 3500 USD but seems like a very powerful piece of software, but again, no point animation in it.

Also, to compare TBAP 2 with ASP 8 is a bit of non sense really, as TBAP 2 also offers pretty good composition tools along with good animation tools.

One thing TBAP 2 has that kick ASP8 butt is the 3D environment, which is far superior to ASP in any way.
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Post by Matsuemon » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:57 pm

Oops, sorry guys. Didn't catch that you were talking about Animate, specifically =P
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