Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby DarthFurby » Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:02 am

Nice InfoCentral, I'd seen that one before. Haven't had a chance to play with Freestyle yet, but it looks cool.
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby exile » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:39 pm

Just to add a related subject: I recently signed up for a 2D in Blender course from the Morevna project, which features an add-on called COA (cut-out animation). I have no business ties to Morevna. I know it's easily said, but there is no collusion between me and these Russians. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IcXTg4OQMU
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby InfoCentral » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:22 am

Interesting, but the course won't be available till March some time. The price is right but in watching the YouTube video he has you install Gimp and the exporter plug-in. The project website says they are only going to be using Krita so something isn't clicking here.
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby patricia3d » Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:14 am

Thanks downloading. can you provide some blend with GP tool.
download my free 7 Free cc0 files from here https://www.blendswap.com/blends/user/1472
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby dkwroot » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:23 am

InfoCentral wrote:Interesting, but the course won't be available till March some time. The price is right but in watching the YouTube video he has you install Gimp and the exporter plug-in. The project website says they are only going to be using Krita so something isn't clicking here.


Krita hasn't implemented a scripting interface yet (coming in 4.0), so the guy who created the cutout animation tool(CoA) for Blender wasn't able to make an exporter plugin for Krita. He did create one for Photoshop and GIMP though. It seems that they're going to have you design and draw characters in Krita and then export the finished file to GIMP. In GIMP, you'll use the CoA plugin to export to Blender.

So basically, GIMP is used just for the cutout animation export plugin.

If you're interested in CoA, just watch all of the development logs from its creator. He shows you how it works and everything it's good for. There are several logs, so watch them all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krCYZ7BPdCI

I've used the CoA tools several times, it's pretty cool. You can further extend the usefulness of the tool with my switch layer script which can be found here: http://www.lostmarble.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=30448
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby exile » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:24 pm

Great to get all these suggestions and offers of help. I tested the plug-ins for Gimp and Blender. They worked on the sophisticated test character from Morevna which included switch layers. Looked good after the import but I don't know how to rig yet.

I thought the course was supposed to be based on using open-source software. In any case, it's true that it hasn't started yet, they're trying to get bookings in advance as crowd-funding for a film project. Anyway, thanks for the information that there are different approaches to using the COA tools.
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby exile » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:20 pm

Just to say the Morevna course is now delivered. I watched the 33 minutes of video, interesting, but haven't recreated the rigging they show. I wonder if anyone here has experience with 2D rigging in Blender and can compare the quality of the meshes with Moho. On the Morevna video everything looked great, but that always seems to be the case with demo videos. I remember trying out the bone-mesh approach in Open Toonz and was disappointed - Moho smooth joints wins hands down against that without even going through the trouble to mesh.

Something else was interesting. Morevna reported Russia wants to invest in animation software to keep animators from having to use proprietary software in a cloud outside of Russia. Morevna is trying to convince them to invest in open source products that already exist and retrain studio artists. Supposedly the Russian government wants to invest up to $2 million in animation software development. https://us7.campaign-archive.com/?e=dd48ec121c&u=63b93b2125fac4b2dfd44e05f&id=abac88e661
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby Psmith » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:18 pm

Hi Steve:

The Russians are smart and frugal. They won't invest in anything frivolously. Neither will I (now).

OpenToonz is, at present, probably the most complete 2D (free) software available - which I have already invested a lot of time learning and demonstrating. It is an odd piece of software - being very complex, on top of that. (It was created in Italy . . . by Italian engineers . . . and artists . . . being of a "unique" tradition and mindset).

If there was a large enough (paying) audience, I would offer a Udemy Course covering the most powerful use of its features and tools. I know there is a small population of people who will pay nothing - but I have no way to determine how many would subscribe, at some fee, for such a Udemy course. I'm not even sure that you (my most vocal fan) would do so.

So, these are my observations and experiences so far.

As for Blender and 2D animation - we might have a long wait to have access to a finished version of Grease Pencil.

Andreas Esau's endeavor with COA Tools seems also stalled, at present.

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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby InfoCentral » Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:13 am

It was an interesting read but I am sure the Russian Govt wants to develop their own proprietary software and not dump money into open source for everyone's benefit. It would be nice but I don't see it happening.
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby exile » Mon Mar 12, 2018 4:45 pm

Psmith wrote:Hi Steve:

The Russians are smart and frugal. They won't invest in anything frivolously. Neither will I (now).

OpenToonz is, at present, probably the most complete 2D (free) software available - which I have already invested a lot of time learning and demonstrating. It is an odd piece of software - being very complex, on top of that. (It was created in Italy . . . by Italian engineers . . . and artists . . . being of a "unique" tradition and mindset).

If there was a large enough (paying) audience, I would offer a Udemy Course covering the most powerful use of its features and tools. I know there is a small population of people who will pay nothing - but I have no way to determine how many would subscribe, at some fee, for such a Udemy course. I'm not even sure that you (my most vocal fan) would do so.

So, these are my observations and experiences so far.

As for Blender and 2D animation - we might have a long wait to have access to a finished version of Grease Pencil.

Andreas Esau's endeavor with COA Tools seems also stalled, at present.

Greg Smith


Greg, if you go through with this, I' would give it a try - not for $200, but it could be more than the Morevna Blender course. It has only 25 students for the English version, by the way, so you can see that crowdfunding and even low-cost Udemy courses are not a quick way to make big money.

However, I think you would be doing something for yourself: You would be forced to concentrate on one software for a while. You took me on quite an Odyssey, from OT to Blender GP and got me to look into a commercial version of Toonz as well as Spline or Spine, which I haven't bitten on (yet).

The timing of your post is quite a coincidence - I was playing around with OT and realized I had the wrong settings for drawing - too much smoothing. So it is usable with the equipment I have, after all. At one time I was at lower intermediate level with the software, but got very frustrated with the loss of coloring in shapes that were completely closed - a bug that others have also complained about. Someone posted that it works better now. (?) I tried installing the new 1.2 regular version yesterday, and had no drawing canvas. The Turtle Tooth pocket version and the Morevna edition seem to work, at least. However, the hyped new feature of guided drawing with automatic tweening has been a flop for me so far, even with simple smileys.

At the moment I'm working hard to complete a music video, and you'll never guess which software I'm using in hopes of finishing the project before forever: Moho. It's funny how the reality principle kicks in when you want to really get something done. To reduce the work load I'm using the lyrics with still images for the verses, but that still leaves a 20-second introduction (animation done) and a 40-second guitar solo which I also want to animate. 40 seconds is a long stretch to animate. By the time I'm done I'll have forgotten what I learned about Blender in the past weeks and may have to eat my words in this thread defending its interface as reasonably user-friendly.

This is probably more than you wanted to know about where I am at this particular time. The good thing about software like OT is that it forces me to work on my drawing skills, which is not a waste of time even if the attempt to create an animation fails. The skeleton-based part of the program is less appealing for Moho users, IMO, unless I've completely missed possibilities of the program.

Let me know what you decide concerning a Udemy course!
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby Psmith » Tue Mar 13, 2018 1:02 am

Steve:

Sorry about the roller coaster ride . . . but, at least it was thrilling, right?

I really like hearing about your endeavors - and I really do understand the desire to finally finish something memorable before the impending "forever".

Regarding OpenToonz and "Bones" - it was actually the bones that were the original attraction for me regarding the software. I don't mean OpenToonz "regular" bones ala the "Skeleton Tool" - but the much more flexible option of "bones" or "nodes" as made and manipulated using the Plastic Tool. Here's why:

1) Nearly all of the functions of Plastic Bones can be accessed simply, directly and in a "tactile" way.

2) Automatic "meshing" of both vector drawings and raster drawings is incredible - saving much time. Nearly any kind of bend or stretch can be achieved by means of making the Mesh "rigid" in some parts and "flexible" in others (detail can be controlled by Mesh Density - found in the "Create Mesh" dialog).

3) Z-Depth of any part of the Mesh can be sorted on the fly - moving one part of an arm or hand in front of or behind another part of a character, for example - as it moves through a scene.

4) Object "attachments" can be fastened to any Plastic "node" and released at any frame in the animation (for picking up and holding things - or throwing them).

5) Parenting Plastic Nodes is quite simple and straightforward - being accomplish by first clicking on the node you wish to be the parent - and then clicking anywhere to place the child node. To see such flexibility and utility, watch my video about making a crawling worm:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkoX4kMRZlA

Though it's quite a task mastering the complexities of OpenToonz, it does contain all the tools and functions to make an animated short, music video or feature film - all in one place. You also can't beat "FREE", either.

Thanks for your encouragement - and I may go forward with a Udemy course - but I really need, at this stage in my life, to get rich QUICK ! (or else).

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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby exile » Wed Mar 14, 2018 12:39 am

Greg,
I see I missed some Opentoonz Training tuts after all. I don't think you need vocal support from me, the tutorials speak for themselves. Well thought out and structured without the maddening lengths that most how-to videos have. I'd much rather stop and rewind than sit there and wonder when the relevant parts will begin.

Thankfully, without dreadful background music - please continue resisting that fad.

Once I start bombarding you with questions in the Udemy course you'll wish you'd chosen something more lucrative like mopping floors or flipping burgers. But good work is 1) satisfying and 2) could build a following as the word spreads.

All the best,
Steve
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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby Psmith » Thu Mar 15, 2018 5:18 am

Steve:

I have participated, at length, in the very lucrative trade of floor mopping and toilet cleaning - becoming expert in both skills - though I have foolishly chosen to move forward into what I thought were greener pastures in more recent years.

Regarding my training style - people either love it or hate it. Mostly, the audience comments I have received have been positive - but several have been left which were quite blunt: "This guy is so *&%(*$% boring!" and "these tutorials are too robotic sounding to me." People have accused me of using speech synthesis, as well.

Having a background music track, to me, is unbearable and monotonous to the utmost degree. I simply can't watch these kinds of videos. Nor do I feel the need to take up valuable screen space with a meaningless recording of my mug - doing really interesting things like clicking a mouse, staring at a monitor, squinting and rubbing my nose.

I'm just not the entertainer most people are looking for - if entertainment it is.

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Re: Blender New Innovative 2d Animation "GP Tools"

Postby herbert123 » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:00 am

Just watched the documentary "Kingdom of Dreams and Madness", a film about Studio Ghibli and in particular Hayao Miyazaki as he and his team work and finish "The Wind Rises". An impressive documentary, and I would urge anyone even remotely interested in animation to watch it.

And it includes a scene with our beloved OpenToonz (or Ghibli's version of it at the time):
Image

Btw, Turtletooth restored the all-in-one transformation handle function (finally!!!). And a nice change to the function editor as well - no more graph editor popup. https://gumroad.com/l/TZmmM

Also, Nvidia and AMD cards are better utilized in this latest portable version.

I have to mention that on Nvidia cards it is best to create a separate OpenToonz profile in Nvidia's control panel, and set the performance to maximum. It can make a heck of a difference - did for me.

As for Blender's GP tool and 2d animation: the point of the Blender Foundation's officially sponsored 2d animation project is meant to get the tools to production-proven state. it is going quite well. Together with v2.8 and the realtime render engine "Eevee' 2018 is looking to become another very interesting year for Blender.
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