AS has potential really but......

pabmove · Post by **pabmove** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:07 am

....the drawing tools are so crap

The biggest downer that AS I find, is that it's trying to be as individualistic as possible but because it's so specialistic all the conventional tools which the average joe is use to such as familiar shortcuts such as crtl c etc.... really makes this software difficult to work with...

For all the AS diehards; I've really have tried to play around, work with the exercises and I have even taken a course!

I hope the company really overhauls the tool layout and make it more user friendly.

I'm going to stay away from this one and if I were going to use AS, I would use another graphics program for the design and use AS to animate.

Again, this is only one mans opinion..... but does anyone agree with me here?

Rasheed · Post by **Rasheed** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:48 am

People either hate or love AS tools. There seems to be no in between.

The problem is that AS has a completely different approach to drawing than most of us were used to in creating digital art. Most programs use a kind of simulation of drawing and painting, as we do in the real world. This is an extra layer between the user and the rendering engine. While it is beautiful, it also eats precious processor cycles. Because AS doesn't take advantage of hardware acceleration, it has to be very lightweight and can't do the fancy "act as in the analogue world" stuff other programs offer.

So you get a more basic user interface, where the user has to do more thinking to get things done. The advantage is when you have mastered these tools, you have much more control over your drawing and animation than in those other programs.

And in the end animators want more control.

jahnocli · Post by **jahnocli** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 1:29 pm

I love AS, but I have to agree with you about the tools! Some people on the forum have grown to love them, but, as things stand, it would take a lobotomy for that to apply to me. AS does what no other animation program can do for the price, but I'd rather draw stuff in other programs and suffer node tweaking hell than "draw" them in AS.

I've ranted about this elsewhere (!), but for me, AS doesn't HAVE any drawing tools -- it has "shape-building" and "line-construction" tools -- but that ain't drawing...

slowtiger · Post by **slowtiger** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 4:30 pm

Vector graphics is, after all, no drawing. So I don't expect AS to have "drawing tools" - if I need drawing, I draw, or use different software. AS should, however, have a consistant and comfortable way to change between tools, select/deselect, and do other common things in a way that is common to most programs.

DarkCryst · Post by **DarkCryst** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 8:10 pm

I actually really like them, and did so from the start - however I think they should be expanded to include things like bezier handles and such like.

This would make life much simpler for me at least, I also think it would help people a LOT.

artfx · Post by **artfx** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 9:47 pm

I did the tutorials and got up to speed with AS in on night. It is certainly very different than Mirage, but I wouldn't want it to try and be Mirage either. If I need that, I use Mirage. For what you get, AS does ver well at approximating drawing while ceating the vector shapes which allow for greater flexibility while animating.

I do agree about the drawing tools, but then I DO draw in AS. I take the pencil tool and draw like I would any image. When I have something I like, I will close the shape and fill it. Not too different than working in raster. What I get by working this way is that the character looks different than a lot of vector stuff I see on TV. It has crossing lines, weights to edges and other features of drawing, but is still an editable vector. I like that I can even adjust line weights after the fact.

CartoonM!ke · Post by **CartoonM!ke** » Wed Nov 29, 2006 10:34 pm

When I first picked up Moho, it drove me crazy. I went though the tutorials and had luck with them, but then when I tried to create some stuff of my own, it was major headache city. It wasn't until I realized (thanks to another thread, like this one) That I wasn't using the tools the best way. I needed to first import a file that I created in bitmap drawing program (Manga Studio, Painter or my current fave TV Paint Animation) and then used Moho (which was rebranded Anime Studio) as an ink and paint program. By having an underdrawing to use as reference I can then put together a character/prop/whatever and make use of layers and such for animation.

As time and experience with AS increases, so does my appreciation for its tools. It's the old saw: "A poor craftsperson blames their tools." Once I started using the tools to create, instead of figuring out how to use them like other programs that emulate "real world tools", I began to see how well thought out they are. I like the way curves are done, if the points had handles (like in Illustrator and flash) then that could add to some animation issues. I'd rather just do point animation when needed to refine the bone animation. It's easier to add an extra point and move it around to get a curve I want instead of using handles.

Now if there was some way to get "pathfinder" abilities into AS, boolean combine, subract, etc... then that'll be great.

jahnocli · Post by **jahnocli** » Thu Nov 30, 2006 11:36 am

cartoonMike wrote:It's the old saw: "A poor craftsperson blames their tools."

You know, I can't help thinking this is a reference to me...I'm not blaming anything (or anyone) -- I'm expressing an opinion. Can't you tell the difference?

Rasheed · Post by **Rasheed** » Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:12 pm

I value your opinion, jahnocli, and I don't want you to feel uncomfortable reading posts on this forum.

To all: please let us stick to the matter at hand, and don't get too personal. This is a technical forum, not a social interaction forum.

cribble · Post by **cribble** » Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:29 pm

Nothing wrong with a bit of social... so hows your day been?!

To the matter at hand, i started off with AS drawing tools, so i've never had a problem with them. Though i do find now, when i switch over to Adobe software i find i can't use their tools. I think it's a matter of practice, i mean, did anyone master 3Dmax in a day!

CartoonM!ke · Post by **CartoonM!ke** » Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:34 pm

Just to be clear, I was refering to myself when I wrote about "blaming the tools." It was not a slight to Jahnocli and I apologize for any discomfort I may have caused.

Your opinion, Jahnocli, is a very valid one. One that has much merit. My post was just an account of how my ability to use AS grew and developed.

pabmove · Post by **pabmove** » Thu Nov 30, 2006 7:03 pm

good to see everyone have almost the same views as me. Here are some negatives about AS.....

1. Its such a pain to switch back and forth from my fav graphics package to AS. Please improve the drawing tools.

2. What gets me is the tutorial. When I try to find something more specific it takes me ages to find the information. As a beginner, I found this really fustrating. I would like to see a search function?

Ok, so MOHO was bought but at least the company should make improvements. AS can't be doing so bad business wise but it could really sell more if it could overhaul the GUI and make it more user friendly. I'm sure it will attract budding animation beginners...

ingie01 · Post by **ingie01** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:56 pm

I can't help but mention cartoonmike's post again.
In a community of artists tools and materials are something that will continually pop up and bring up opinions.
"As time and experience with AS increases, so does my appreciation for its tools"
Like any skill, one needs practice and time!
Cribble- not suprizing if you use only the one tool set......

Rasheed · Post by **Rasheed** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 12:58 pm

And talent, I would like to add.

ingie01 · Post by **ingie01** » Fri Dec 01, 2006 1:03 pm

Ahhh, Rasheed,
Another very deep and potentially dangerous area of discussion.
I have often wondered about "talent".
Socially, psychologically, and yes, physically!

AS has potential really but......

AS has potential really but......

[OT] Apology

Glad its not just me....