Suggestions for Moho to go OPEN SOURCE. Discuss

General Moho topics.

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Suggestions for Moho to go OPEN SOURCE. Discuss

Post by Guest » Fri Sep 01, 2006 2:32 am

Moho should go open source if the creators want it to go mainstream. I mean sure they wouldn't get paid for selling the software anymore, but if they supervised its evolution into later versions (like Ton Rosendaal does for Blender, it's original creator) from not just the Moho community but the Entire Open Source community too it could become something greater than our expectations. Better than Toonz Bravo, Mirage Studio, Toon Boom or Flash! Who Knows!!!!!!!! :)

I only look at Blender, Inkscape and GIMP as examples and see how far they have come, they pretty much match and in some cases exceed full price retail software. I would be interested in what people have to say on this matter...
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heyvern
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Post by heyvern » Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:07 am

I can't figure this one out... I have never understood the open source... uh... group... market... whatever it is.

... Why would someone... give away a source of income? Take an application that brings in money... and make it free.

Moho has enough support and dedication from paying customers... why give that potential away?

If Moho is open source... then... no money? Right?

What FINANCIAL benefit do the "owners" of Moho get from making it open source? None as far as I can tell. Who cares how "important" it becomes... that doesn't pay the electric bill.

If someone wants to... help out the "community" by giving something of value away for free... that is a choice. But if your creation is worth something... shouldn't you be compensated for it?

I know there are segments of this philosophy out there that think ALL software and music... and movies... should be free... I don't know how any of you expect inovations when there is nothing to pay for it.

I think this is... a great idea! I would love to get Moho for free... but... I also think it is a stupid idea. I have no idea how "open source" works... even though I use several open source applications.

Is it just... people being really nice and generous? Is it karma?


-vern
Patmals
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Re: Suggestions for Moho to go OPEN SOURCE. Discuss

Post by Patmals » Fri Sep 01, 2006 8:27 am

Guest wrote:Moho should go open source if the creators want it to go mainstream. I mean sure they wouldn't get paid for selling the software anymore, but if they supervised its evolution into later versions (like Ton Rosendaal does for Blender, it's original creator) from not just the Moho community but the Entire Open Source community too it could become something greater than our expectations. Better than Toonz Bravo, Mirage Studio, Toon Boom or Flash! Who Knows!!!!!!!! :)

I only look at Blender, Inkscape and GIMP as examples and see how far they have come, they pretty much match and in some cases exceed full price retail software. I would be interested in what people have to say on this matter...
You are aware of the direction Moho will be taking very soon, don't you?

I think the option of going 'open source' is not an option now, nor do i see a reason for it in its current situation.

And speaking of going 'mainstream', this is the direction it is heading in.

but..it would be nice open source.... the community (developers..which i a m not in that category) would build upon.

But "MOHO" has new pastures ahead of it...

Anime Studio
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7feet
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Post by 7feet » Fri Sep 01, 2006 9:24 am

Directly, I think Mike should get paid. He's developed a nice piece of software that a fairly big company thinks is worthy of distributing. I think that's good.
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Re: Suggestions for Moho to go OPEN SOURCE. Discuss

Post by Manu » Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:02 am

Guest wrote:Moho should go open source ...
Sure, as soon all housing, supermarkets, governments, industries and public transport go open-source. Until then, we'll have to pollute the purity of our creative process with yukkie money.
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Post by The400th » Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:24 am

I think our Guest is a plant from a rival software company who, having seen the direction that Anime Studio is going in, wants to rain on the parade.

On the bright side, it shows that eFrontier are doing the right thing, if they are making the competition resort to cheap tactics like this. :D
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Post by Patmals » Fri Sep 01, 2006 10:41 am

The more i think about it, the more I am pleased it is E-frontier who will be building upon, with LM, the next stage of Moho.

E-frontier are a company who deliver creative tools and content.

Moho does fit perfectly in their line.

BTW, if you are not already, i would sign up (FREE) with content paradise and download your full copy of Poser 5 !!

its free for 4 days only!

(I sound like some cheap salesman now.. :) )
Any extra content for Anime Studio will be available from content paradise anyway!

http://www.contentparadise.com/us/user/ ... duct_21989
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Post by 7feet » Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:53 pm

Open Source Metrocards! Yeah! More free rides!

I don't expect the subway to be free any time soon (although that would be a Really Nice Thing), and in the same respect I expect anything to be free. Open source doesn't immediately equate to free Free! FREE! I wouldn't mind, under copyright restrictions, having accesss to some more nuts-n-bolts. But if that meant it would be harder to give my son anything, (if this was a thing I depended on) I wouldn't have to think a second before saying gotohell. I like throwing the scripts out there, but programming-wise, I'm a dilletante. If I could write Moho, then I'd have done it. Barring that, I'll just contribute as I can. Blah!

I was never much of a fan of Poser, and I've seen a world of crappy images done with it, but I'm all happy with free. Thanks. Mad Cool, yo.
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Post by jahnocli » Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:31 pm

Guest wrote:I would be interested in what people have to say on this matter...
Oh yeah? Well, who are you? In any case, the decision has already been made, so there's nothing to discuss...
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
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Post by Guest » Sat Sep 02, 2006 1:07 am

Well that was a big negative from 6 people. Unfortunately I asked for a discussion on it, not a judgement of whether it was a good idea or not. I think you all took it the wrong way completely. Let me explain.

I'm aware that Anime Studio is going to be released but all the people on this forum complain that 'Moho' isn't going to be around anymore, THAT is what I'm talking about, the creators can keep on going ahead with Anime studio, but the original Moho should be released to Opensource. Branch the two out, the Original Moho to go OPENSOURCE and for Anime studio to be developed with E frontier on the other way. Let one program develop on its own in one direction and vice versa!

No I'm not from a rival company, oh yes that makes a lot of sense, talking about opensource when I'm from a different software company. I am a filmaker, I'm an avid user of Moho, but I'm also aware that it has a very small niche market at the moment and its potential could be far greater.

Have any one used programs like Blender or GIMP then you should know that this software is extremely powerful and was only achieved through the Opensource community.

So the fact that its developer wouldn't get paid, that is a stupid Idea is it, Money makes the world go round and all that jazz? The developers can go ahead and develop Anime studio, but remember it will be greatly different to what Moho is. They can still earn money from moderating Moho like sell T-shirts or printed Manuals, anything really! You are right, they deserve to earn money from this great piece of software. But lets face it, Moho won't be around anymore, thus my sufggestion for it going open source. It is a valid one.

What I propose is an effort to sustain and preserve Moho for what we all know and love it to be, that is all. I wouldn't say it otherwise. Believe me, it would be very worth it. 8)
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Post by J. Baker » Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:58 am

Guest wrote:...the creators can keep on going ahead with Anime studio, but the original Moho should be released to Opensource. Branch the two out, the Original Moho to go OPENSOURCE and for Anime studio to be developed with E frontier on the other way.
Then people would just freely use the "opensource Moho" and not buy AnimeStudio. Being that they are the exact same product. Just different names.
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Post by heyvern » Sat Sep 02, 2006 4:44 am

From the small amount of knowledge I posess of the "open source"... thingy...

I don't think you're suppose to have... the "same" source code... open source... and for sale... how could one set of the same code... be open and the other... have a ULA that prohibits reverse engineering or decompiling?

Anime Studio is the same source code as Moho. Anime Studio is Moho... it just has a different name. I seriously doubt efrontier is going to... reinvent the wheel... just so Moho can be open source.

If Anime Studio has feature X... then... some programmer could add it to Moho and now it's free. They would be competing with themselves constantly.

And what if a cool feature for Moho showed up in AS? How would that be handled under the "open source" concept?

I don't see this idea working at all. Someone needs to create a BRAND NEW APPLICATION... totolly new and unique source code that READS AND WRITES Moho/Anime Studio file format... then make it open source.

This is how the Gimp works... it opens the same files as Photoshop. Blender opens the same 3D files that other expensive programs open.

On the topic of Gimp and Blender.... ick... I tried to use them both... Gimp was... well.. if you can't afford Photoshop... if you can't afford anything it works.

Blender was a total nightmare for me... very obscure and weird interface. I gave up... I have used A:M for years anyway... so I hate polygons.

-vern
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Post by jorgy » Sat Sep 02, 2006 5:02 am

I am a big fan of open source software. I like having control since I am a tinkerer at heart. To those who say you can't make money with open source, take a look at Redhat - it's just a matter of rethinking your strategy. Instead of selling the software, sell the services. In the case of moho, don't sell the software, sell the services of the customization or the scripting or the addons. Remember, there is a lua interface.

Having said that, I don't think that this is the right time for moho to release the source code. I am excited to see what will happen with the new partnership with e-frontier and want to see what will happen. Give it some time! I want to see what Mike can do now that he has some marketing and some R&D budget. Moho has always had a lot of potential. Let's see now what AS can become.

jorgy
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Post by Patmals » Sat Sep 02, 2006 9:33 am

Sounds a little confusing - like TV Paint / Mirage / Aura.

They are all pretty much based on TV Paint.

I think that is a little confusing as what new things will emerge in which software - am i using the right version for my needs, etc

But i do understand what you mean.

I think the long time Moho users are a little anxious as it is with what Anime Studio will become.

But i do agree with Jorgy.

Open source software is great! lots of interesting ideas come around and free 'alternatives' for those who cannot afford the full high price software - but i think it is still too early to think about open sourcing.

Lets wait and see.

By the way, Guest, have you had a look at Synfig yet?
Theres still alot to do but its alive and looking promising.
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Post by jahnocli » Sat Sep 02, 2006 11:48 am

Guest wrote:What I propose...
Your proposals may carry more weight if you weren't hiding behind the word "Guest"...
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
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