How long can a video be?

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Matoran
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How long can a video be?

Post by Matoran » Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:20 am

Hi. I'm currently using Anime Studio Debut 8 (I know, it's old), and I've noticed that my videos can't be longer than 2 minutes. This really isn't enough time for me. I could just make two separate videos and then put them together in another program, but working on just one video would make my life a lot easier.

So my question is, has Anime Studio allowed us to use more frames in Moho Debut 12, or is it still just 2 minutes?

Thank you.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by dueyftw » Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:59 am

All Debut versions have a frame or time limit.

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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Matoran » Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:03 am

dueyftw wrote:All Debut versions have a frame or time limit.

Dale
What would that time limit be..?
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by slowtiger » Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:09 am

In a professional workflow you only do one scene per AS project, render to (uncompredded) video, and assemble in a video editor.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by dueyftw » Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:14 am

As Slowtiger said. Debut has enough room to make normal shots of a animation. If I have anything over 20 seconds, there must be a very good reason. Otherwise I will cut it up. I use Pro.

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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Greenlaw » Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:56 pm

Unless you have a compelling reason to sustain a single two minute scene, I would create the movie in separate short scenes and cut them together in a video editor. Single scenes running several minutes can be difficult to plan and edit. And even when they're done well, many people won't have the patience to sit through a really long single cut scene unless it's VERY interesting. A typical scene in most modern productions is rarely over five seconds long. (By 'scene', I mean single editorial cut of course. In live action, this unit is more commonly called a 'shot'.)

I like Vegas Pro for editorial because it offers great flexibilty for cutting footage in a variety of sources and formats, and it gives me a lot of control in sound editing. If you're on budget, there's a cheaper 'entry level' version called Vegas Movie Studio ($50.)

There are also a lot of really cheap video editors and a few free ones too. I would seek out for reviews to be sure you're getting a suitable one for your project.
Last edited by Greenlaw on Mon Jul 31, 2017 2:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Matoran » Sun Jul 30, 2017 11:52 pm

Thank you for your replies. However, strangely enough, none of you answered my question. I'm working on YouTube videos that'll be about 2 - 4 minutes long. Scenes will definitely change (such as closeups, and entirely different pictures (usually moving) appearing throughout the video). I'm just wondering if Moho Debut 12 allows us to make scenes that are over 2 minutes long. Thank you..
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Matoran » Mon Jul 31, 2017 12:13 am

synthsin75 wrote:User manual, page 410.
But I don't even own the software... Can you please just tell me up to how many frames (or how much time) are allowed per video in Moho Debut 12? Thank you.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Greenlaw » Mon Jul 31, 2017 12:56 am

Pro has unlimited scene length; Debut is limited to 2 minutes or 3000 frames per scene.

Here's the complete list of differences between Pro and Debut:

http://my.smithmicro.com/docs/moho/Moho ... onList.pdf
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Matoran » Mon Jul 31, 2017 2:15 am

Greenlaw wrote:Pro has unlimited scene length; Debut is limited to 2 minutes or 3000 frames per scene.

Here's the complete list of differences between Pro and Debut:

http://my.smithmicro.com/docs/moho/Moho ... onList.pdf
Thank you for answering my question! Aw, that's unfortunate. I'll just stick to my Debut 8 for now, then.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Greenlaw » Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:02 am

Greenlaw wrote:...A typical scene in most modern productions is rarely over five seconds long...
Just an FYI for anybody who's interested in this sort of thing: check out the website called Shot Logger.

A few years ago I used data from this site to help work up a bid to direct an animated feature film for an indie movie studio. The info helped me come up with practical designs and studio pipeline, and an estimate for how many scenes we could afford based on the proposed running time and budget.

For example, here's the data for Finding Nemo: http://www.shotlogger.org/ShotListV2.php?recordID=561

As you scroll down this list, you'll see that most of the scenes run only 1 to 4 seconds. This helped me figure out how much time we could spend on each scene and how many artists we'd need to complete it on time.

This is the kind of stuff I geek out over.

(P.S., So what happened to the film? I wound up passing on the gig to work at DreamWorks instead. I don't have a lot of info about the project afterwards, but looking back, it was probably a sensible decision for me.) :P
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by hayasidist » Mon Jul 31, 2017 7:42 am

Greenlaw wrote:For example, here's the data for Finding Nemo: http://www.shotlogger.org/ShotListV2.php?recordID=561As you scroll down this list, you'll see that most of the scenes run only 1 to 4 seconds. This helped me figure out how much time we could spend on each scene and how many artists we'd need to complete it on time.
a question for you on this - where two (or more) shots are essentially the same (e.g. 26 and 34; 110 and 112 just to cite two examples) would you have them both in one (Moho) file and do the cut in post or have separate files?
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by slowtiger » Mon Jul 31, 2017 9:09 am

If two or more shots really are the same, I may them into the same file for practical reasons (if they're really short), or do a first shot, then duplicate this to create the rest.
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Re: How long can a video be?

Post by Greenlaw » Mon Jul 31, 2017 4:18 pm

That's a good question. I'm not sure there's a right way or wrong way...it depends on the workflow, and what will work more efficiently for the sequence.

If you're working with a team, everybody needs to agree on certain rules and standards. When any deviation to scene setup and naming standards becomes necessary for a sequence, everybody needs to know about it. Actually, it doesn't matter if you're working on a team or by yourself, you just want to do what works most efficiently, and you need to be able to quickly find your stuff. This is especially important in a team situation because any artist may be asked to pick up a scene that was previously worked on by another artist.

That said, I typically like to create a new scene file based on an existing 'master' file where I may have initially completed or at least blocked out the motion for all the similar scenes. Or, I might do as Slow Tiger said, just animate one, and then duplicate that scene and modify it. By making one, you've essentially created a template for the othe scenes.

The reason has more to do with simplifying scene management: every scene normally gets logged separately and it exists in its own scene directory. Changes are typically scene specific so, when they're asked for, I go to the individual scene files and revise them.

Naturally, there is a downside to this setup: if a major 'across the board' change is required, like replacing a background art, or adjusting timing to an looping animated elements, then you may need to fix every scene that was broken out from the 'master' file separately. Thankfully, Moho 12 has Referencing and other features to help make this kind of updating easy. (Well, most of the time anyway.) :)

Now there's nothing wrong with always keeing a 'master' scene file for multiple scenes. In some situations, it may make more sense to keep the scenes in one scene file, to always work from that master, and then output the single animation from that file to chop up in editorial. Either way, the setup should be notated in the shot list so any scene can be quickly found later for revision.

Off the top of my head, I can think of a few downsides to this approach: If it's exceptionally long, and the scene gets too complex with a lot of keyframes, it may become slow to animation. If the scenes aren't going to be cut this way in final, why make it difficult? Another downside: if the scene becomes corrupted or you just plain mess up something, you might have just hosed an entire sequence instead of just one scene. In any case, you should make incremental saves and back ups as you work.

I guess it comes down to which way will be faster and easier (or just less headachy) in your situation.
Last edited by Greenlaw on Mon Jul 31, 2017 6:37 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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