Disappointing expensive Moho 12 Update

[SuperSGL]

I've only used ASP since 10 and that was on sale because 11 was just coming out I jumped at the chance to get the FF and now the big deal really to me is the bezier curves! I've used CorelDraw for years since version 3 I've upgraded 5 times over the years (since around 1993?) every time it was...oddly enough $199.99. I'm use to the tools in Draw so my work usually gets created there first but the export is usually so filled with nodes that I end up tracing by hand and re creating it. Using the tools in ASP 11 get very tedious even after I draw what I want with less nodes, there is alot of time spent with the curve tool. The new drawing tools will literally cut the creating process in half!
Im just a hobbyist so I too will probably wait a bit before buying, usually I wait just because the first new release is so buggy of any software Id like to wait for the update, by the way I havent seen alot of complaining about the last two versions, they did a great job putting it together.

And alot of people at the forum I have seen them complain about changing the name to AS now it is back to MOHO. That is not like changing the title of a web page or renaming a file, it's updating everything commercially and in house and everything in between. (by the way I to paid 149.99 ...for 10 anyway)

[coatsiecoates]

I'm gonna have to be frugal for a minute to afford this, but I am completely stoked about this update, and think it's well worth the money. I would love to have seen an "introductory price", but of course, anybody would.

When a new piece of musical equipment comes out, a musician is more than excited to unbox the expensive piece of gear that does what they want it to do.

The new features in this software, particularly the editing on multiple layers has me jumping for joy.

Rather than be bummed out about one's financial situation and lash out at Smith Micro, people need to look forward to the time when they are able to get v12, and still be happy with how powerful versions 10 and 11 are.

The additional $100 upgrade price is only $3 a day for a single month.

[Oddity]

You're still comparing special sale prices (even if an early adopter sale) versus regular upgrade price. Not a fair comparison. The regular upgrade price from Pro 10 to Pro 11 was $149.99 (not $99): https://web.archive.org/web/20160101201 ... rades.html

So the real, honest comparison is $150>$200.

So while the full price increased by 50%, the upgrade price only increased by about 33%.

You're right about that.

So, just hope there will not increase the price with the next upgrade.

Like i said, Moho is still affordable.
Smith micro need to keep in mind that hobbist and newbies or testers can be the animators of tomorrow...

[Tidou]

Salut Oddity,

De mon point de vue, ce logiciel et les mises-à-jour deviennent trop chères. En fait, on s'achemine vers un programme hybride mêlant 2d et 3d. Le problème, c'est que certaines nouvelles fonctionnalités de Moho existent depuis plus de 10 ans dans d'autres logiciels (opérations booléennes, texture wrapping, etc.). Jusqu'à Moho, Anime Studio ne proposait pas grand chose en terme d'outils. Maintenant, les utilisateurs sont enthousiastes d'avoir -enfin- un programme complet. Mais à force d'acquérir les mises-à-jour, on obtient un logiciel à 1000 euros.

N'importe quel logiciel 3d -même gratuit- permet l'animation de bones, de wrapping, etc.


Il faudra voir ce que les utilisateurs de Moho réaliseront en majorité : des personnages à la South Park, des animations de marche, des têtes qui tournent ?
...

[synthsin75]

Salut Oddity,

De mon point de vue, ce logiciel et les mises-à-jour deviennent trop chères. En fait, on s'achemine vers un programme hybride mêlant 2d et 3d. Le problème, c'est que certaines nouvelles fonctionnalités de Moho existent depuis plus de 10 ans dans d'autres logiciels (opérations booléennes, texture wrapping, etc.). Jusqu'à Moho, Anime Studio ne proposait pas grand chose en terme d'outils. Maintenant, les utilisateurs sont enthousiastes d'avoir -enfin- un programme complet. Mais à force d'acquérir les mises-à-jour, on obtient un logiciel à 1000 euros.

Il faudra voir ce que les utilisateurs de Moho réaliseront en majorité : des personnages à la South Park, des animations de marche, des têtes qui tournent ?
...

Moho/AS has always been 2D/3D hybrid (2D in 3D environment, w/bones that were only in 3D apps at the time). Do you even do much 2D animation? AS was missing some tools (beziers etc.) because its innovative features were considered more important to develop...by the users. 1000 euro? Who's scamming you?

[slowtiger]

There was a software which was 2D and had bones before: Animo, by Cambridge Animation Systems, in the early 90's. Its pricing was prohibitive: a single user license was, in 2000, about 5000.- $.

[Tidou]

Moho/AS has always been 2D/3D hybrid (2D in 3D environment, w/bones that were only in 3D apps at the time). Do you even do much 2D animation? AS was missing some tools (beziers etc.) because its innovative features were considered more important to develop...by the users. 1000 euro? Who's scamming you?

Don't know about 3d engine in AS, I use Debut version 10. Now, I am unable to upgrade anything. I have made only a two minutes movie.
I hesitate to buy version 10 pro because some 3d programs still -overall- most flexible (even for cartoons) and cheaper than Moho.

1000 euros was a joke, but with 2 or 3 next upgrades and some add-ons ...

There was a software which was 2D and had bones before: Animo, by Cambridge Animation Systems, in the early 90's. Its pricing was prohibitive: a single user license was, in 2000, about 5000.- $.

Don't remember this software. By the way I don't remember the price of first Moho release.

[Welsh Jester]

I will say though that the Smart Warp looks like an easy fast way of importing pictures of peoples heads and animating them. Not sure how people usually did that without a lot of hassle before, but now it seems kind of like having crazy talk built into the program which is great. So now it looks pretty simple to animate a body with someones head photo.

[mattchee]

I will say though that the Smart Warp looks like an easy fast way of importing pictures of peoples heads and animating them. Not sure how people usually did that without a lot of hassle before, but now it seems kind of like having crazy talk built into the program which is great. So now it looks pretty simple to animate a body with someones head photo.

I got it. The smart warp is rad. I thought it was going to be just a nifty little feature, but now that I have it, have played with it, and have seen some of the tutorials about it-- there are a lot of possibilities! Pretty quick and easy to set up, too.

[JaMike]

There was a software which was 2D and had bones before: Animo, by Cambridge Animation Systems, in the early 90's. Its pricing was prohibitive: a single user license was, in 2000, about 5000.- $.

And they went bankrupt and were bought by Toon Boom.

They who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it (are you listening, Smith Micro accountants? ).

[slowtiger]

To be fair, it must be said that Animo at that time was a full-fledged production system with some very sophisticated features:
- vector tools like AS, only more so (imagine a different multi-point colour and alpha gradient at each point of a stroke, stroke offset)
- bones, of course
- a scanning module for animation, with automatic alignment
- an automatic stitching module for large BGs
- a phoneme recognition module like Papagayo, but with customizable phonems
- an ink & scan module
- a colour model system with permissions and day/night/whatever variations (imagine this instead of styles)
- a production workflow control module.

[JaMike]

To be fair, it must be said that Animo at that time was a full-fledged production system with some very sophisticated features:
- vector tools like AS, only more so (imagine a different multi-point colour and alpha gradient at each point of a stroke, stroke offset)
- bones, of course
- a scanning module for animation, with automatic alignment
- an automatic stitching module for large BGs
- a phoneme recognition module like Papagayo, but with customizable phonems
- an ink & scan module
- a colour model system with permissions and day/night/whatever variations (imagine this instead of styles)
- a production workflow control module.

None of that vector stuff made it into Toon Boom. I guess the code was deleted by a disgruntled programmer when he/she got laid off.

[Guyon]

It was hard for me to fork over the $200, Especially since I really did not use 11 at all (my fault). But not only was it expensive but the add-ones could really get pricey too. It would have been nice to get the entire package for $200.

[exile]

This thread will go down in history as one of the most long-winded ever. I don't blame SM for reaching for the big time. It's not a large operation and they have to do some hard calculation, just like me. Maybe I should be grateful to SM for exceeding my budget. Trying out alternatives is an adventure. I'm working through the Synfig tutorials, the learning curve really is a challenge. I know some of you work with more than one animation software, that always seemed too much for me. But a challenge can be a good thing.

[SimplSam]

You're still comparing special sale prices (even if an early adopter sale) versus regular upgrade price. Not a fair comparison. The regular upgrade price from Pro 10 to Pro 11 was $149.99 (not $99): https://web.archive.org/web/20160101201 ... rades.html

So the real, honest comparison is $150>$200.

So while the full price increased by 50%, the upgrade price only increased by about 33%.

You're right about that.

......

No. You lovely people are wrong about that.

The full price from $299 to $399 is a 33% increase, likewise the upgrade price is half the full price - so also a 33% increase.