Broken Layer references Cure

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djwaterman
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Broken Layer references Cure

Post by djwaterman » Tue Jun 16, 2015 2:05 pm

I just examined a number of my character scenes and noticed that the layer references were all broken, I don't know why, does this happen once you have any sort of animation in a project?
Anyway, the only way I could restore these was to select each reference layer on frame zero and right click over the point transform and point curvature icons to the left of the time-line and click on the "sync channel to original" that pops up.

If you needed the layer to reference other properties, like line thickness of fill color or whatever, you'd have to go down the list of these and restore them also.

Is this an expected behavior of how ASP works?
It's strange because in the layers menu these referenced layers are all pointing to the original yet in the timeline it says "not referenced".

Other character projects are still okay, they are ones that never had any animation applied (perhaps there's something in that).
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by dkwroot » Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:05 pm

You're not alone, I noticed the same issue. Randomly all of the channels in some of my reference layers will lose sync. To make matters worse, you can't sync them again using the reference dialog options, you have to go through every channel and manually sync each channel.

I'm trying to find a way to replicate the problem and then I'm submitting a bug report.
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by digitalhyper » Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:56 pm

I just wanted to chime in and say that I reported something like that to support. In my case, I created a character and reference layered the entire character and flipped it applying a color to the whole thing to treat it like a shadow. I then had another scene open and wanted to reference in that character and once I did, the reference layer broke. So I ended up just importing the character as a reference, then doing my layer reference for shadow purposes. Just stinks to have to set that up for each scene, unless I save the scene as a new one and wipe the animation to start the next scene.
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by neeters_guy » Sat Jun 20, 2015 6:51 am

djwaterman wrote:Anyway, the only way I could restore these was to select each reference layer on frame zero and right click over the point transform and point curvature icons to the left of the time-line and click on the "sync channel to original" that pops up.
Thanks for the tip. I was experimenting with selgin's head turn and my reference layers broke for some reason (there were keys on all the channels in frame 0). It's tedious having to go through all the channels, but at least I can fix it now.
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by RichardU » Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:23 pm

My reference layers are also breaking. Anybody find a solution for this?
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Víctor Paredes
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by Víctor Paredes » Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:54 pm

RichardU wrote:My reference layers are also breaking. Anybody find a solution for this?
Could you explain the steps to reproduce your problem or post a file to check it?
Also, what version of Moho/Anime Studio are you using?

Thanks
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by RichardU » Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:29 pm

Víctor Paredes wrote:Could you explain the steps to reproduce your problem or post a file to check it?
Also, what version of Moho/Anime Studio are you using?
This was six months ago with whatever version was current at the time (11?). There were no steps required -- happened just about every time I opened the file. I don't have that version or that file now.

Thanks,
Richard
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by Víctor Paredes » Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:04 pm

RichardU wrote:
Víctor Paredes wrote:Could you explain the steps to reproduce your problem or post a file to check it?
Also, what version of Moho/Anime Studio are you using?
This was six months ago with whatever version was current at the time (11?). There were no steps required -- happened just about every time I opened the file. I don't have that version or that file now.

Thanks,
Richard
Thank you,
For some reason, I thought this message was from today... :roll:
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by JimmyMcNulty » Fri Nov 11, 2016 2:59 pm

djwaterman wrote:I just examined a number of my character scenes and noticed that the layer references were all broken,[...]
Does anybody know, if this is (still) a general issue?

I'm testing the possibility to switch from Anime Studio 8 to Anime Studio 12 (Moho again) for the second season of a big TV series. Marco Polo season 1 episode 1 trailer (sorry, just a german version): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwS0MvklScw%20.
I encountered the problem with the broken layer references in my test file, after updating from Moho 12.0 to Moho 12.1 (because of another issue). After a quick search, I found this thread and this is really bad news. If this is a general problem, it's impossible to update. I need the layer referencing, to reproduce MorphDials Script functionality from older Anime Studio versions (controlling all the heads in all character views from one central layer) and still keep the file size down (I think the MorphDials script was way more powerful for this than smart bones, but this is a completely different topic). Besides a central expression control layer, referencing is also nice, to control the hands in every character view from a central hand layer.

Coming from a Autodesk Maya background, referencing, in my opinion, is a very powerful feature. But instable, this could mess up the whole production and we really have to go with the old version of Anime Studio. With all drawbacks.

If anybody could give me some information on this issue, this would be very nice. I will also contact the support, but I will do some further testing as well. Btw. I can't post any files, because of non-disclosure agreements.

Johannes

edit:
Company Showreel (also some Marco Polo around 3.33 and another Anime Studio project around 3.09 (Fennel Vennel 19)): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnXZyNy-0_M
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by chucky » Sun Nov 13, 2016 2:54 am

HI Johannes,
Could I suggest that even if you didn't use references that Moho 12 is a way better option than earlier versions for many, many other reasons.
I have been using references for a short film with well over 100 scenes and it has worked fine.
If there is a problem with a specific function, then you might need a temporary workaround , but no doubt it will be found and fixed.
If it being used on a series then I'm sure (just guessing) any bug you report would get attention very quickly, the devs are very considerate and take the concerns of users very seriously in my experience.
Also the betas are pretty fastidious , go with Moho! :)
BTW was that first series done in ASP or Maya?
Love the design and colours, Moho could help definitely with foot slipping and just make the rigs work a bit more flexibly.
Oh , very impressive reel btw. Wow
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Re: Broken Layer references Cure

Post by JimmyMcNulty » Sat Nov 19, 2016 2:18 pm

chucky wrote: I have been using references for a short film with well over 100 scenes and it has worked fine.
If there is a problem with a specific function, then you might need a temporary workaround , but no doubt it will be found and fixed.
If it being used on a series then I'm sure (just guessing) any bug you report would get attention very quickly, the devs are very considerate and take the concerns of users very seriously in my experience.
Thanks for the information about referencing. Right now, it looks good for me too. Maybe it was a problem with the update from Moho 12.0 to 12.1.
I know the support is very helpful, but bigger problems in the middle of the production would be a very expensive issue. With the start of the production, a lot of people rely on a smooth running production schedule. So 40-50 people can't work for days or weeks? Fixing hundreds of animation shots? No, thank you. This is something, I don't want to encounter. :wink:
That's why I'm a little sceptical, because of a thread like this. But, as I said, it's looking good right now.
chucky wrote: BTW was that first series done in ASP or Maya?
The first link (first season of marco polo) was done in Anime Studio 8.2, but there is some 3D involved. As I remember, the 3D was done in Maya.
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