Losing quality in movie editor

[3deeguy]

The quality of Anime Studio Pro is great when I export an animation to AVI. If I re-render individual clips in a movie editor I lose quality. I have been completing individual scenes, saving them as individual files and rendering them as AVI then clearing all animation from the document before starting new scenes.
I am so disappointed with the quality of external movie editors that I want to reassemble all of the files in Anime Studio (if I can) and export them as a single AVI movie.
Is there another solution?

[sbtamu]

What format/codec are you rendering them as in the editor? That seems to me where the problem would be.

[heyvern]

The problem is probably double compression.

When you edit video or create animations and then export to video format, you often will use some type of compression. Whenever you use compression of ANY kind you lose some quality. The compression allows for gigantic videos to be smaller for upload or streaming.

The key to not losing quality is to not use ANY compression during the editing process. The only time compression should be used is when you do a final export of the completed project or if you do test exports at a smaller size for preview.

When I do any project of this type, whether Anime Studio or 3D or anything else, I always export uncompressed at 100% full quality. When I export from Anime Studio to load in a video editor, I export to "Animation" or "PNG" format at "Maximum" quality. File sizes are HUGE but the quality is 100%. I could also export to image sequences but the movie format keeps it "contained" for loading into other applications.


As for using Anime Studio as a video editor it could be done but I don't think you can do "non destructive" exporting of video. Anime Studio is a "3D" program and video imported and then exported is going to be "rendered" by the application. The resulting video will not be the same as the original. I would recommend doing video editing in a video editor.

This also applies to any video editing application. If you import compressed video, and export compressed video you will have compounded quality loss.

[3deeguy]

sbtamu, I tried both AVI mpeg4 and Quicktime. I posted an unlisted video recently and I didn't like the resolution at all. Certain things I can let go because I'm gaining experience but 'crappy' resolution is unacceptable.
heyvern, I still don't know how to use image sequences (it's OK) nor do I have an adequate understanding of most file formats but I will apply what I just learned about the effects of compression.

[heyvern]

sbtamu, I tried both AVI mpeg4 and Quicktime...

When you say you tried AVI mpeg4 AND quicktime which format did you choose for quicktime? What "version" of mpeg4 did you use? I think there are few. h264 (almost the standard now for streaming) is "based on" mpeg-4 but is the newest and "best".

Another issue is video with lots of fast movement and action. You will see this sometimes when you watch tv. If it has super fast action the picture quality will drop. TV is "streamed", compressed, and the broadcasters may provide more extreme compression to save on bandwidth for some programming resulting in lower quality. Most compression technologies compress are based on movement.

If some of your videos have worse quality than others, check the options you choose for export and see if one video has more fast movement than another. I am no expert on this but do know that there are settings that can seriously effect the quality and size of the final output... all kinds of fiddly things like block size, bits per second... all that kind of thing that can have a DRAMATIC effect on quality.

If you have fast internet and lots of bandwidth, you can upload video to youtube or other services at FULL resolution with no compression, let THEM convert (that's what I usually do). Doing this of course can take much longer but if you compress BEFORE uploading you can often get worse results.

Depending on the video software you use, you can also export directly to youtube specific formats. These will be optimized for that type of playback and limit any degradation during upload and conversion.

[hayasidist]

just as Vern has said - if (as I do) you export from AS for use in a video editor it's vital to export lossless (uncompressed AVI; PNG sequence ...)

and ...I'll often export "oversized" for the final video format "just in case" -- so if I'm planning on a final (composited) render at 1920*1080, I'll set my AS project to be at least that - maybe as high as 4608*2592 if there's even the smallest chance that it'll be needed in 4k.

yep - some HUGE intermediate files, but that's the only way to prevent the sort of issues you've had.

[slowtiger]

I render all files that go into editing in 1920 x 1080px, PNG codec with millions of colours. No quality loss.

[3deeguy]

I exported a file to PNG last night and discovered it produced an image sequence. I woke up still puzzled about how to convert an image sequence to AVI. Additional reading suggests "Final Cut Pro" might be an option.
The variety of things I have to learn seems astounding at times. I've begun to see why file compression should be the last step.
I found that a complete project was too difficult to manage as a single file. It is best for me to break an animation into smaller pieces.
hayasidist, I'm going to test "uncompressed AVI" in addition to looking into software like "Final Cut Pro".

[hayasidist]

I use premiere, so can't really speak for final cut, but most of these editors will import an image sequence... you need to tell it the duration of each still image (often the default is "a few seconds" because the editor is more usually used to make video slideshows from photos) -- for the PNG sequence it's (obvioulsy!) 1 frame! (plus set the framerate to be the same as used in AS, and say "no transition" and ... and ...)

Uncompressed AVI is my personal favourite (because it's just one file) BUT many people prefer PNG because it's easier to correct errors / resume a render sequence after a crash if you have your eggs in many baskets. I think PNG sequence is also more space efficient (I think it uses lossless compression) and avoids having the one big file that blows (32 bit) file system file size limits with only a few seconds of rendered output.

[3deeguy]

hayasidist, thanks for replying so quickly. I have Vista so I have to use Premiere too. PNG images are crisp. I like the way they look. Premiere is a bit pricey so I want to take a closer look at Adobe Premiere 'Elements' first. I don't want or need all the 'bells and whistles' of the full version but I absolutely want crisp resolution.
I have not finished testing 'uncompressed avi'. If I have to get the full version then that's what I'll do. Presentation counts for a lot.

[hayasidist]

premiere and photoshop elements bundle is a great starter... (just looked at amazon - GBP62 / USD110 at present).

PrEl will do image sequence and AVI.

good hunting!

[heyvern]

When you were discussing exporting to png, I assumed incorrectly you were referring to quicktime movie export using png format.

You could try that if it's available for your system. Export to QT so it's a single movie file, using png as the format and the quality set to maximum. This would result in the same "crispness" as exporting to a png image sequence but give you that single movie file format.

The crispness is due to nothing more than a series of single images rendered as files in that image format. You could choose, jpeg, targa or bmp and get the same maximum quality. You could choose to export to a quicktime movie and use PNG format at maximum quality. You would end up with a HUGE file size. Maximum Uncompressed AVI should give you the same crisp output but you end up with much larger movie files that most likely won't play smoothly without a lot of computer power.

Before I got a super fast computer, when I rendered Anime Studio projects to that format, I could not play back the videos smoothly because there was no compression.

[3deeguy]

'QuickTime', 'PNG', 'Best', 'Premiere Elements'... I am learning a ton of stuff. I still have to do everything I've learned here. I'm going to guess I'm not the only one who needs this knowledge..

[heyvern]

Ha ha! Yes!
Lucky for me I have a buddy who knows this stuff inside and out. When I have to export video from AfterEffects or Premiere I just ask him what settings to use and which numbers to plug in. I can barely remember half of it.

This is why I always start with the highest resolution and quality possible. No matter what I need to export it will always be "lower" than what I started with.

[kphgraphics]

(I posted an unlisted video recently and I didn't like the resolution at all.)

If you posted on a site like Facebook, youtube, or some there service like this that may be the reason for the quality loss also.