This is so true! Good feedback!Rudiger wrote:Hi Tori,
Thanks for asking for our opinions.
I will always upgrade without fail as I can see the potential in this software to be the greatest 2D animation software around. Also, I have become completely addicted to the level of customization that is possible with scripting.
However, I too agree with a lot of what is being said by other experienced users here. It seems like with every release, there are new features being added, but not a lot of improvements to existing features. I've tried to compensate for this by scripting my own tools to get around some of the software's limitations, but it does take a lot of time that I could otherwise be spending creating animations.
While I do see the importance of adding new features to stay competitive with similar software and attract new users, I think that improving the existing features is also of vital importance for keeping existing users and helping with word of mouth advertising.
Waiting to upgrade? Tell me why!
Moderators: Víctor Paredes, Belgarath, slowtiger
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digitalartguru
- Posts: 93
- Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 3:15 am
Tori
I think one of the problems is your not using the program.
Try this:
Get a copy of 5.6 and draw something, anything. Now Hide it from view until frame 48. Their is a dialog box on the right side of the time line. Open it and set the right keys to 0 and 100.
Even a complete beginner should have this done under two minutes.
Now do the same thing with version 6, 7 or 8.
When you figure it out you will start to understand were all the complaints are coming from.
Not all changes are for the best. Just look at the screen shots of some of the most of the hard cord users, replacing half the tools with user scripts and only years later does Smith Micro add only a few of the user functions.
Dale
I think one of the problems is your not using the program.
Try this:
Get a copy of 5.6 and draw something, anything. Now Hide it from view until frame 48. Their is a dialog box on the right side of the time line. Open it and set the right keys to 0 and 100.
Even a complete beginner should have this done under two minutes.
Now do the same thing with version 6, 7 or 8.
When you figure it out you will start to understand were all the complaints are coming from.
Not all changes are for the best. Just look at the screen shots of some of the most of the hard cord users, replacing half the tools with user scripts and only years later does Smith Micro add only a few of the user functions.
Dale
Well now I'm paying the same price as a user of the basic program to get my upgrade. Not really impressed by that, or the features which seem more geared toward the beginner.
I want improvements to how actions are implemented, upgrading the tools to match the quality of Fazeks, better motion blur, a more 'bone morph dials' way of blending actions (Morph dials is quite slow to interact with, integrating a proper version could be a lot faster), saving/loading actions etc.
Basically more tools on the construction/animation side, not the wizard side.
I think I just convinced myself to save some money.
I want improvements to how actions are implemented, upgrading the tools to match the quality of Fazeks, better motion blur, a more 'bone morph dials' way of blending actions (Morph dials is quite slow to interact with, integrating a proper version could be a lot faster), saving/loading actions etc.
Basically more tools on the construction/animation side, not the wizard side.
I think I just convinced myself to save some money.
I use AS as a hobby. It's an amazing tool and I would never had gotten started in animation without it.
Previous versions were easy upgrade decisions, the camera tracking, physics and multicore rendering were all cool features I knew I would use and there was no workaround.
AS8, although I think the wizard is a nice idea, it's not for me as I feel like I've achieved more if I create from scratch. The render styles look good, but I can probably do that in Sony Vegas so there's not much in AS8 that I can't do in older versions or with external programs.
For me the biggest frustration I have is with the basics, making joints deform nicely, accidentally selecting the wrong bone, or if you click on a point and miss it by a few pixels, the whole line gets selected! Using images as a shape's background, I wish that worked. And Styles.... I have never been able to understand styles.
Fixing those things alone would make me buy. Anyway, enough of my moaning. It is a great programme. I look forward to v9
Previous versions were easy upgrade decisions, the camera tracking, physics and multicore rendering were all cool features I knew I would use and there was no workaround.
AS8, although I think the wizard is a nice idea, it's not for me as I feel like I've achieved more if I create from scratch. The render styles look good, but I can probably do that in Sony Vegas so there's not much in AS8 that I can't do in older versions or with external programs.
For me the biggest frustration I have is with the basics, making joints deform nicely, accidentally selecting the wrong bone, or if you click on a point and miss it by a few pixels, the whole line gets selected! Using images as a shape's background, I wish that worked. And Styles.... I have never been able to understand styles.
Fixing those things alone would make me buy. Anyway, enough of my moaning. It is a great programme. I look forward to v9
ShoePie.co.uk - My animations.
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SvenFoster
- Posts: 400
- Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:50 am
- Location: stephen.foster.uk(skype)
Longtime lurker, Parttime animator, fulltime software developer(not animation software). Only registered to give my opinion...so hear it is 
First off.. I quite like AS7 pro so dont think I'm anti AS..
I wont be upgrading just now but may well do so in future for the following reasons;
* General feeling of lack of investment on Smithmicros part. Be it true or not.
* Glitches, bugs and such are a common theme in my version and I dont see any plans to fix them...oh new version fixed? doesnt sound like.
* I saw one patch release and upgraded and saw no real improvement.
* price differential. I spent the full whack on AS7 and felt ok with it.. a few months later it went down significantly. that happens.. however no improvements forthcoming and then pow..new version.
* upgrade price. Quite simply. no incentive to upgrade. No loyalty repaid. Almost full price to upgrade?
I like it, I do. I think its really easy to use and somethings are a doddle but the business model of create "major" release number and try to get everyone who uses it to upgrade (aka pay almost full price, for a very incremental release) is blatant.
I want Smith to make money off AS... I think it could be the best thing out there and true its not as expensive as some...irrelevant. The market decides what the price is and at the moment, based on general feedback its telling you its to expensive.? why if its cheaper? hmmm VFM.
If SM want to fix this.. and I hope they do I would suggest.
* Setup a proper bug tracking and feature request site.
* Regular updates with small fixes.
* Communicate with users a roadmap of where you/we want to take AS.
* reach out to user base.. hobbyists and Pros, what their workflow is like.. what annoys them, how could you make it easier(for everyone)
* When you release a Major version, It must be..
- Packed with fixes
- New features that make people go wow!!
- Priced appropriately. Upgrade prices should not be prohibitive. These are your loyal users.
Now, I know it has a useful scripting environment and this is where is can make a real difference.
* setup an official repository.
* get your own developer(s? lol) creating scripts as well.
* review their quality and ensure they are useful.. optionally Add an update that will automatically install them if people want them.
* Post some tutorials, offer some coding help on forums..
* re-affirm the sense that SM cares about AS and its community.
look guys, sounds like a rant, its *not*. trust me. I love AS7 but think its either not well supported or poorly communicated and sense that most of its glory are from when it was aquired..sorry. As I say, I'm a full time software dev/designer and I'm offering some free advice.. (novelty )
Until your users are screaming at you.. please please please when is that release coming its gonna be awesome.. here is my cash. (because they know what will be in it, for the most part) you haven't made it.
I know its a balancing act between making money and resources, I do it day in and out. I however think the best way to make money is to make the best software and give the best service topped off with the best community. AS has some of it.. but a way to go.
Yes I registered the forum today, no I'm not a troll, Yes I like AS, No I dont think an upgrade is worth it yet...
Ps: this is why I dont post lol
Steve
First off.. I quite like AS7 pro so dont think I'm anti AS..
I wont be upgrading just now but may well do so in future for the following reasons;
* General feeling of lack of investment on Smithmicros part. Be it true or not.
* Glitches, bugs and such are a common theme in my version and I dont see any plans to fix them...oh new version fixed? doesnt sound like.
* I saw one patch release and upgraded and saw no real improvement.
* price differential. I spent the full whack on AS7 and felt ok with it.. a few months later it went down significantly. that happens.. however no improvements forthcoming and then pow..new version.
* upgrade price. Quite simply. no incentive to upgrade. No loyalty repaid. Almost full price to upgrade?
I like it, I do. I think its really easy to use and somethings are a doddle but the business model of create "major" release number and try to get everyone who uses it to upgrade (aka pay almost full price, for a very incremental release) is blatant.
I want Smith to make money off AS... I think it could be the best thing out there and true its not as expensive as some...irrelevant. The market decides what the price is and at the moment, based on general feedback its telling you its to expensive.? why if its cheaper? hmmm VFM.
If SM want to fix this.. and I hope they do I would suggest.
* Setup a proper bug tracking and feature request site.
* Regular updates with small fixes.
* Communicate with users a roadmap of where you/we want to take AS.
* reach out to user base.. hobbyists and Pros, what their workflow is like.. what annoys them, how could you make it easier(for everyone)
* When you release a Major version, It must be..
- Packed with fixes
- New features that make people go wow!!
- Priced appropriately. Upgrade prices should not be prohibitive. These are your loyal users.
Now, I know it has a useful scripting environment and this is where is can make a real difference.
* setup an official repository.
* get your own developer(s? lol) creating scripts as well.
* review their quality and ensure they are useful.. optionally Add an update that will automatically install them if people want them.
* Post some tutorials, offer some coding help on forums..
* re-affirm the sense that SM cares about AS and its community.
look guys, sounds like a rant, its *not*. trust me. I love AS7 but think its either not well supported or poorly communicated and sense that most of its glory are from when it was aquired..sorry. As I say, I'm a full time software dev/designer and I'm offering some free advice.. (novelty
)Until your users are screaming at you.. please please please when is that release coming its gonna be awesome.. here is my cash. (because they know what will be in it, for the most part) you haven't made it.
I know its a balancing act between making money and resources, I do it day in and out. I however think the best way to make money is to make the best software and give the best service topped off with the best community. AS has some of it.. but a way to go.
Yes I registered the forum today, no I'm not a troll, Yes I like AS, No I dont think an upgrade is worth it yet...
Ps: this is why I dont post lol
Steve
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SvenFoster
- Posts: 400
- Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:50 am
- Location: stephen.foster.uk(skype)
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digitalartguru
- Posts: 93
- Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 3:15 am
Good ranting Steve! Very constructive and to the point.SvenFoster wrote:Longtime lurker, Parttime animator, fulltime software developer(not animation software). Only registered to give my opinion...so hear it is
First off.. I quite like AS7 pro so dont think I'm anti AS..
I wont be upgrading just now but may well do so in future for the following reasons;
* General feeling of lack of investment on Smithmicros part. Be it true or not.
* Glitches, bugs and such are a common theme in my version and I dont see any plans to fix them...oh new version fixed? doesnt sound like.
* I saw one patch release and upgraded and saw no real improvement.
* price differential. I spent the full whack on AS7 and felt ok with it.. a few months later it went down significantly. that happens.. however no improvements forthcoming and then pow..new version.
* upgrade price. Quite simply. no incentive to upgrade. No loyalty repaid. Almost full price to upgrade?
I like it, I do. I think its really easy to use and somethings are a doddle but the business model of create "major" release number and try to get everyone who uses it to upgrade (aka pay almost full price, for a very incremental release) is blatant.
I want Smith to make money off AS... I think it could be the best thing out there and true its not as expensive as some...irrelevant. The market decides what the price is and at the moment, based on general feedback its telling you its to expensive.? why if its cheaper? hmmm VFM.
If SM want to fix this.. and I hope they do I would suggest.
* Setup a proper bug tracking and feature request site.
* Regular updates with small fixes.
* Communicate with users a roadmap of where you/we want to take AS.
* reach out to user base.. hobbyists and Pros, what their workflow is like.. what annoys them, how could you make it easier(for everyone)
* When you release a Major version, It must be..
- Packed with fixes
- New features that make people go wow!!
- Priced appropriately. Upgrade prices should not be prohibitive. These are your loyal users.
Now, I know it has a useful scripting environment and this is where is can make a real difference.
* setup an official repository.
* get your own developer(s? lol) creating scripts as well.
* review their quality and ensure they are useful.. optionally Add an update that will automatically install them if people want them.
* Post some tutorials, offer some coding help on forums..
* re-affirm the sense that SM cares about AS and its community.
look guys, sounds like a rant, its *not*. trust me. I love AS7 but think its either not well supported or poorly communicated and sense that most of its glory are from when it was aquired..sorry. As I say, I'm a full time software dev/designer and I'm offering some free advice.. (novelty
Until your users are screaming at you.. please please please when is that release coming its gonna be awesome.. here is my cash. (because they know what will be in it, for the most part) you haven't made it.
I know its a balancing act between making money and resources, I do it day in and out. I however think the best way to make money is to make the best software and give the best service topped off with the best community. AS has some of it.. but a way to go.
Yes I registered the forum today, no I'm not a troll, Yes I like AS, No I dont think an upgrade is worth it yet...
Ps: this is why I dont post lol
Steve
I am also a programmer ( not for animation software ) and I think that people like us can bring very useful feedback to help Smith Micro make Anime Studio a better product and also gain their users loyalty back. Not only do we understand the way software development should work for better service and customer loyalty, but we also use Anime Studio.
I agree with every single thing you said.
Not only did you point out all the valid issues that Anime Studio users are making on this forum and steering them away from the new upgrades, but you provided very useful constructive solutions. I think you summarized everything very well to represent a lot of us that share the same thoughts and feelings on the product.
I hope Smith Micro finally listens to us and bring back their loyalty and caring for their user base. This is the only way Anime Studio is going to survive in the future.
What they need to understand is that WE REALLY DO CARE about the product. WE WANT TO HELP and be part of the SOLUTION, but we need them to really care and proof to us that they do listen and that they also want to make Anime Studio a better product FOR US.
Regards!
Thanks Guys! I sent a note to the teams this morning with your feedback. I appreciate your dedication to the product, it's fantastic to see. Honestly, it's why I love my job so much. Hopefully we can create a stronger relationship with you all going forward, and remedy some of your concerns.
Happy Monday!
Happy Monday!
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SvenFoster
- Posts: 400
- Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:50 am
- Location: stephen.foster.uk(skype)
@digitalartguru I'm glad that you saw my comments as they were intended and thanks for yours, I hadnt intended to capture the spirt lol but hey.
@tori customer facing and love your job really? I do suspect most of the gripes and slow take up is due to perception.. but SM can do something about that too..
asking the question is a major step and credit where its due... Here's hoping.
nice one.
...jeez now I've registered spose I'll have to browse the forums more
@tori customer facing and love your job really?
I do suspect most of the gripes and slow take up is due to perception.. but SM can do something about that too..asking the question is a major step and credit where its due... Here's hoping.
nice one.
...jeez now I've registered spose I'll have to browse the forums more
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digitalartguru
- Posts: 93
- Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 3:15 am
Thanks for taking the time to listen to us Tori. May it lead to good things.Tori wrote:Thanks Guys! I sent a note to the teams this morning with your feedback. I appreciate your dedication to the product, it's fantastic to see. Honestly, it's why I love my job so much. Hopefully we can create a stronger relationship with you all going forward, and remedy some of your concerns.
Happy Monday!
Last edited by Manu on Mon Jun 13, 2011 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yup - I know - I don't know anyone (who I don't work with) that loves their job as much as me. I guess it's because I was planning to run off and be a special ed teacher in New Orleans with Teach for America when I got a temp job at Curious Labs...and then never left...because I love that my career has to do with empowering artists. (Again, do the people at Excel get this payoff?!) My official title is "Sr. Online Marketing Manager" but I've built my role on the communication with users, artists relations, social media and etc.SvenFoster wrote: @tori customer facing and love your job really?
I'm here to advocate for you, but I'm also here to communicate for the awesome teams inside too - who really do care. I think that's part of it too - the motivations of the people behind this product are really great...and I agree and think we can do a better job of showing you that we're moving in the right direction. I've found over the years with the Poser community that information is power, and sometimes you have to ask what the perception is to help shift it. So that's why I wanted to pop in and see what the conversation was before I tried to find a message to share.
It's very hard to be this customer facing - that's why I asked for you to be gentle. I take it all very personally, because I love the products and I love the people (both development and customers.) I think that's what makes me good at my job.
Btw, I should note this, so no one feels abandoned if I don't answer right away. There may be times I disappear from here for a couple days - but that's only because I am responsible for a lot of products and a lot of plates that have to keep spinning - but if something comes up - send me a PM, post on FB or tweet to us, and I'll try and hop back as quickly as possible. Thanks!
PS - Is anyone going to SDCC at the end of July? I'll be there Wed, Thurs and Friday. Looking forward to going back - it's been 2 years off the show for me and I'm ready to get back in the action!
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digitalartguru
- Posts: 93
- Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 3:15 am
Tori,digitalartguru wrote:Amen to that! I am hoping for the best. Thanks Tori.Tori wrote:Hopefully we can create a stronger relationship with you all going forward, and remedy some of your concerns.
Happy Monday!
If there is going to be an update on the character wizard soon, so that we can also customize our own bodies ( a true character wizard ), please let us know a.s.a.p. If this happens, I will not request a refund on AM8 Pro. This is the only major improvement attempt that ( if completed properly ), can be worth the full upgrade price. All of the other improvements are very minor or can be accomplished in other ways.
A fair discount for this version 8 upgrade will also persuade me to keep it.
Otherwise, I will just get a refund and wait until the next release which I am hoping for it to be more of a full release will better features and most importantly bug fixes and improvements.
I am looking forward to a new improved relationship with SM. Let's make Anime Studio the best it can be!
Thanks again!