Waiting to upgrade? Tell me why!

General Moho topics.

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Waiting to upgrade? Tell me why!

Post by Tori » Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:00 pm

Hi There -

I thought I'd introduce myself, since I've been popping in here more regularly the last week or so. I'm Tori, and I've been with the graphics products for over 10 years now, and been with Anime Studio since we picked it up at e frontier. I've worked with the web and marketing teams and manage a lot of the social media and user outreach projects - but have mostly worked with the Poser community and worked on Content Paradise while Sarina worked on Anime and Manga. I'm super sad to see her go, she was a lot of fun to work with - but now I have this great opportunity to work closer with more of the product communities!

To start, I'd love to get more up to speed with the who's and what's of things, and am going to try and be around for the next couple weeks just to 'meet' some of you, and to get a feel for what you're making and how you feel about things. I love launching new versions of products. Being a bridge between the users and the internal teams make release times an exciting moment to see all the hard work received by people who get so much enjoyment out of the product. (I sometimes wonder if the marketers for Excel get that payoff...) Anyway, I'm pretty stoked on this new Anime Studio version - they really put a lot of effort into bringing tools like the Character Wizard to the table, and I'd love to know what you're thinking about the new version and if you're not getting it just quite yet, if there is a reason. (I mean, it's pretty awesome...but I know that there are some people not fully on the bandwagon yet!)

I'll ask that you be gentle - I'm trying to ease in, and I'm aware forums can be political, heated and loaded, but I'm trying to start a dialogue, so please forgive me if takes me a bit to catch up or if I'm not too up on all the technical speak. Mike's popping in, but I'll also do my best to communicate what I hear or get answers for questions where I can.

So say hi - feel free to introduce yourself - let me know what you do with the application, what you love, what you hate, and all that jazz.
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Post by hothead » Thu Jun 09, 2011 9:54 pm

i use AS as a hubby just for fun. i upgrade to ASP7 which is the worst thing i ever do i just wast my money on a software that has a lot of BUGS so i wont spent a cent on this one ASP8 untill i know on try it before i spend a cent on it. the lost time my friend try AS7 30 days trial he did not like the upgrade too an he also forget the cancel the trial order untill he get the order bill. so i dont want to pay for a software that useless to me or i forget to cancel...
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Post by mykylr » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:33 pm

My main reason to wait is the high cost of upgrading. As I mentioned on an earlier post elsewhere for $59 or $69 for these 5 days it would have been a no brainer to upgrade as the new tools do seem very good from what I have seen.

However for only $29 reduction special its not really an impulse buy at $99 so i am waiting till I need to use AS pro.


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Post by ponysmasher » Thu Jun 09, 2011 10:40 pm

Hi Tori!

I'm a swedish animator and I've been using Anime Studio since at least 2004. It's the software I use the most and I'm currently making a six part animated documentary series for television broadcast in Sweden, Norway and Finland. It's exclusively animated in Anme Studio Pro.

I love the software and I always upgrade as soon as a new version is out, however I'm not a huge fan of the direction the software has taken since changing from Moho to Anime Studio. It seems like it's becoming more of a hobbyist tool than something used by professionals, which I feel is a shame. Although the upside I guess is that it's very cheap software.

It's still the best animation software I know of though, and it's paying my rent. And I really like some of the latest new features (round caps, transparent gradients, shape selector, being able to access actions with scripts, importing layered photoshop files etc).
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Post by rpc9943 » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:12 am

Last edited by rpc9943 on Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by chucky » Fri Jun 10, 2011 12:42 am

Hi Tori,
It is great to have you here on the forum, I'm impressed by you candour and willingness to communicate with the user base.
I have been using Anime since the moho days and it is my primary application for animation, though I own toon boon animate for fbf and it's superior drawing tools, I also used mirage before it was taken over by tv paint ( nice software that).
I have to agree somewhat with ponysmasher, definitely the pro label is missing its mark.

Here is a rather cheap clip I did using anime and painter together.I used the motion tracking to reinterpret video of the band and just about every feature in the anime toolset.
Here are a few more small examples- just the colour ones.
I have another which I can't post just yet until its formal release for this I included some 3d elements, but I comped the footage inside ASPRO after rendering in hash animation master> I tried to use the anime/poser tools first of course.
I really like some of the new features I bought ASPRO 8 the day before yesterday.

round caps- makes for a little better freehand drawing (no need for tapering).It does fix the line breaks, but unfortunately creates a false sense of security as we get tears across shape fills when shadows or outline layer effects are implemented.
I can't script, but the scripting improvements are always good there are some amazing talents on this forum (too many to list) who have made some awesome tools for aspro.
The new fill feature is pretty good, although the auto weld/ autofill feature seem to have been strangely implemented.
The character wizard is a beguiling feature that I held great hope for.
Unfortunately the examples therein are truly horrid and a real turn off for anyone who has reached a professional level.
We really need to be able to use this as a tool to organise our own characters rather than reuse those ones. I have yet to fully test this, it may still be good but I can hardly bear to open the pallette....eeeek.

The gradient transparency feature is definitely the kind of thing we will al find useful ...yay!

However there doesn't seem much bang for the buck in the new release.
I really think the presentation of ASPRO need work both in marketing and interface. The splashscreen and default file are rather insignificant examples but nonetheless first impressions that immediately give a hobbyist impression. Many of us make our own and replace these defaults, just to start work with a more comfortable vibe.
Take a look also at Ramon Lopez' Lost layer tool.
That is the kind of ingenuity and innovation that ASPRO needs.

I hope I don't sound too negative, I am actually about to use ASPRO again very soon for a few more pro projects< I do find however that I am rather secretive about the software when it comes to telling my colleagues. I know that people used to using programs like zbrush maya photoshop, after effects painter toon boom and even flash can't help but to look down their nose at Anime,if only for those surface qualities that make it appear so......hobby.
I would much prefer to show it off and hear comments like "Wow, what is that program? I can't believe I haven't heard of it"

Thanks again Tori for your introduction, you give me much confidence for the future development of ASPRO through your genuine interest.
Last edited by chucky on Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:22 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by mykylr » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:17 am

Just wanted to jump in again. I ummm bit the bullet and ummm what can I say.

This seems, from my quick play around, to be the version I have been waiting for. I can finally draw naturally without the technical side of things getting in the way. This version does have bang for the buck if you want to get on, create and animate but had issues with previous versions.

I have done in about an hour three very quick test animations from a traced image a drawn image within AS pro and an imported image with no issues or gotchas whatsoever.

Fantastic release. Although I am a bit embarrassed after saying earlier I would wait... :D


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Post by chucky » Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:21 am

Oh yea the auto trace, I really wanted this but haven't got a very good result yet from my tests. I shall persist I guess but it does seem to miss sharp corners and thinner lines.
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Post by drumlug13 » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:12 am

I watched the webinar and other vids you posted on Youtube and the new features look cool.

I have to hold off on the upgrade because I just bought AS7 about 2 months ago. If I would've known then that 8 was just around the corner I would've held out a little longer. It's not that I don't want to upgrade I just can't squeeze it into my budget right now.
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Post by Diana Kennedy » Fri Jun 10, 2011 7:19 am

Hi Tori!

Yes, great to have you here.

I am using Anime Studio since Version 5. I like it very much and I also think is currently the best animation software.
I just upgraded to ASP8, but I am not really happy with this upgrade. Things like the character Wizard are simply useless for me as I create and draw my own characters.
Like Pony Smasher said, these are hobbyist-tools and I am also concerned that the software will too much develop toward a hobby software. The tracing tool sounded promising, since I scan in my characters instead of drawing them within AS, but the tool is not good enough for me to work with.
But well, Dollar is cheap as dirt right now, so it wasn't a really big expense to upgrade.

I do animated films, little ones, but also longer projects to be published on DVD.
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Post by Patmals » Fri Jun 10, 2011 10:07 am

H Tori,

I was very excited at first with ASpro 8 and (perhaps) foolishly rushed and bought it upon release.

Now..I am sorry to say that I consider it a big anti-climax.

- The character creator is only good for fun not for any serious work.
- The image tracer sounded incredibly good, and it was one of
things i requested when Fahim was asking for feature requests for
v6. However, it's current implementation is far-off from what it
could and should be.
- rounded edges and the freehand update are pobably things i find
geniunely useful in this update.

I was considering returning this version (never done that with 6 or 7) but i think i will just hold on to it and hope for a patch..soon.

By the way, it crashed on me! The other versions rarely ever do that.
Last edited by Patmals on Fri Jun 10, 2011 1:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by slowtiger » Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:02 am

I will not update because AS is for OS 10.5 now - I still run 10.4.11 and will not change that on this machine. (Or does it run on 10.4.11?)

Other reasons for not upgrading:
- default interpolation hidden in prefs instead of easily accessible on timeline top (since v6)
- no simple editing of same properties of multiple layers at once

I really appreciate new drawing tools, round line endings, the "patch" concept, but for me it's the interface that counts. Every saved click speeds up the workflow.

I've used AS heavily in nearly every production since 2004, because it's a reliable helper and in some parts, like multiplane rigs, much faster than TVPaint which is my other animation software.
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Post by 2ner » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:33 pm

I bought Moho 5 long ago and I bought ASP7 a few months ago. I haven't gotten around to actually doing anything with it yet, but plan to soon.

The upgrade price is too high. I've already bought the product twice, but you're only offering me a 23% discount compared to a new customer.

Instead of developing as a professional animation tool, ASP is trying to become a sort of 2D Poser, with template-driven ready-made instant animation. Alpha gradients, rounded end caps, and live update with other apps are all old news with other tools which professional animators use, and I'm glad to see them finally in ASP. I wish you would take the word "Pro" in ASP literally and develop the pro version for professional use, and make the debut version friendly for non-pros with templates, content marketing, etc.

Anyway, I'll be waiting to see a real discount offered before I buy.
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Post by dueyftw » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:37 pm

I upgraded, just waiting for the CD.

What I hate is it not like upgrading but I feel like I'm re-buying software I already own. Do you have to charge as much as you do? I don't mind if the cost is worth it. But I don't like paying for software that crashes or has bugs.

Bugs that aren't fixed. And slow to be fix. I'm already thinking when will be the patch for vision 8. The attitude should be no bugs in the software no matter what. If that takes giving beta versions away to a few testers or hiring more software engineers, then do it. Stop being so frigging cheap!

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Post by jahnocli » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:43 pm

Hi Tori,

I'm a long-time (hobbyist) user of Anime Studio from Moho days. I still use version 5.6 -- I have been tempted to upgrade on a few occasions, but always managed to resist. A lot of recent developments such as collision physics and Poser imports are of no interest to me. It's great software, but I'm no upgrade junkie. Take a look back through old Feature Requests if you are genuinely interested; very few of mine have been implemented.
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
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