Why does these things happen?

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eric1223
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Why does these things happen?

Post by eric1223 » Fri Jan 18, 2019 9:19 pm

With this happening, I have finding myself having to delete a character again. Somehow, the character head glitches in the mainline, and behaves really stranger in the actions. His bones become waaaayyyy disconnected from his body, and scrambles, his head flips upside down and his face isn't there, and if u mess with some of the controls in the action (head turn 2 esp) then go to the mainline, his body become scrambled and a mess, until u go backward on the timeline.



I've tried to go back and fix this, and I can't because it just gets too weird. With that said, his Character is beyond saving, and now I have to start over. How do I avoid things like this. I didn't have this problem in v11. My only 2 guesses is not to use smart bones, and don't use the multi keyframe edit features.

Here is the file and I put notes on it.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4zcs8v8at4x7o ... .moho?dl=0
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synthsin75
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by synthsin75 » Fri Jan 18, 2019 11:00 pm

eric1223 wrote:...his head flips upside down and his face isn't there...
This one is because the "Head" bone is keyed in "Head U/D 2" but not in "Head U/D". If you select that bone in "Head U/D" and reset it's position on frame 150, the head will be fixed. You'll might need to exit and reenter the action for it to display correctly.
...the character head glitches in the mainline...
You need to make sure you key frame one in a smart action and that the smart bone doesn't have the same rotation in both actions.
You also need to make sure only the animation channels you want controlled are keyed in smart actions, and avoid from keying those channels in the mainline to avoid conflicts.

Here's those fixes: http://www.filedropper.com/s3-2edited

Don't know if I'll have time to investigate the rest, but you might see if those pointers help with them.
- Wes
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eric1223
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by eric1223 » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:07 pm

Thanks Synth. I appreciate what u did. Now I know what to do and what not to do.
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eric1223
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by eric1223 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:32 pm

K, So I decided to remodel the whole thing all over and start from scratch. I did the most of the major animations first, then I tried to go back to make the smart bones. I got some odd results. Upon creating one and being on frame 0, I noticed the head lost its curvature, and anything beyond frame 0, the head goes to 1 tiny point near the torso, the napkin, and the leg stretches as well. This is before I make any keyframe.

At first I was thinking " Hmm, maybe its because I hit undo while I was setting up smartbones?" but I went back to an older version of this scene (a previous increment) with the major animation finished, but no smart bones. When I tried to add some, it did the exact thing.


Then I thinking "Hmm, what if the animation on the mainline is causing this?" So I deleted the animation from the entire document, and there was only a little deformation of the head. Thats the only thing I noticed anyway.

So maybe I'm not supposed to have a keyframes anywhere on the mainline before I start animating.

Here is the file.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7zzkezewa6rdr ... .moho?dl=0
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synthsin75
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by synthsin75 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:33 pm

Here's a much simpler solution. This menu script seems to fix all the problems you mention on both files: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=32714

It finds odd keyframes in the negative timeline and lets you delete them. If the list of negative keyframes is too long, and the YES/ON buttons are off screen, just hit "Y" to delete the keyframes.
- Wes
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dondo
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by dondo » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:03 pm

Once again I boggle at how much time you have to help us, Synthsin75. Thanks again.

Follow-up question: When I get bitten by this, it's always because when I'm working on a bone's smartbone action (let's call that "Bone A") I've unintentionally introduced a keyframe for an unrelated bone (let's call it "Bone B") . This creates a strange interaction where Bone B sometimes appears to simply not work, depending on the position of Bone A. It took me a while to understand what was going on at all, but now I have the problem of trying to figure out which of the many many bones in my rig is "Bone A."

Is there any good way to do this?
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synthsin75
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by synthsin75 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:07 pm

Select bone tool dropdown, and select the name of the bone.
- Wes
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eric1223
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by eric1223 » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:20 pm

Thanks again! I'm not home yet do i can't use it yet. Really appreciate your help.
synthsin75 wrote:
It finds odd keyframes in the negative timeline and lets you delete them. If the list of negative keyframes is too long, and the YES/ON buttons are off screen, just hit "Y" to delete the keyframes.
I never need a frame beyond 0! I can only think of 2 things how ot happens. Does this happens if I pull a layer beyond 0? Or does it happen when I add a new keyframe that is not 0? Oh 1 final thing i thought of is if I use the multiple time line edit feature wrong. I noticed there is un reachable frames for bones if you forget to edit those along other keys. I need to explain this properly later on.
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synthsin75
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Re: Why does these things happen?

Post by synthsin75 » Sun Feb 24, 2019 12:37 am

I'm not sure what causes it, but some tools do seem to write keyframes in the negative timeline. My guess is that they are meant to be temporary but some of them somehow get left behind (for other scripters, I'm guessing these might be where values like fTempAngle are temporarily stored). And there are some legit negative keyframes, like timeline markers and layer order, that my script avoids.

Considering the frames are around frame negative one million, I'd be surprised if it's anything you are doing wrong.

With my negative keys script it should be easy to check this if things start to act weird again.
- Wes
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