[Cancelled] Doodle style animation project

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mr_projects
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[Cancelled] Doodle style animation project

Post by mr_projects » Sun Nov 13, 2011 10:05 pm

UPDATE:
Project post cancelled.
Thanks everyone

=========

Hi,

I'm working on a project, and I'm looking for someone to handle the animation side.

The task is just character animation, after that I'll be compositing it using After Effects

This is how the character looks like:
ImageClick for large view - Uploaded with Skitch

- The whole piece is 1 min in length, but the actual animation is less than that.
- Epipheo style animation (search youtube for epipheo)

Job details:
- Animator will work remotely using dropbox to share assets also using Skype for briefing and communication.
- Deliverables as follows: First deadline within a week from today, then we will submit to client for review, after feedback, we will work for another 2-3 days for feedback and final polish.
- Budget is $250 paid in full upfront


If you think you would able to take this job, please PM or email me along with your best portfolio pieces and payment information (Paypal or bank info) so we can start right away.

My email is: mr.projects [at] gmail [dot] com

Thanks,

Ahmad
Last edited by mr_projects on Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:51 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger » Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:05 am

So you're asking for 8 - 10 days of work for $ 250.- ? USD? That would be about 181 EUR, less than 3 EUR per hour. Just for your information: a cleaning person gets more than 20 EUR per hour here.

1 minute of completely produced animation (with sound) is about 3000.- EUR here. If we assume it's only very simple animation we may be able to do that for 1000.- EUR. For that budget I can do very fine animation (in TVPaint, which is suited best for this task) which will have a nice hand-made look and impress your client.

Would you like to re-evaluate your project?
mr_projects
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Post by mr_projects » Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:34 am

Just to clarify, the job required is simple animation ( character mostly standing all the time, no lip sync) and what is required to deliver is the character animation only on alpha channel (w/o Bg, props ..etc) meaning just the raw animation.

After the animation is done I will composite it in AE aiming to have something close to that : http://www.epipheostudios.com/#portfolio

(Check --> Different Styles --> Stick Figures video)

Hope that clarifies it a bit and justifies the budget.

Thanks
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funksmaname
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Post by funksmaname » Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:59 am

Hello Mr Projects,
Looking at that example doesn't clarify or justify the budget - it still seems fairly complicated.

What 'might' justify the budget is if you could list the exact number of shots that are needed and their length/content - the characters involved (supplied) and what they need to do...

Only with this information can we know that the budget is 'reasonable' - without this information I can only assume the intire budget wouldn't even cover the time in initial consultation deciding the above.

Are you from epipheo? or is that just the 'style' of what you're trying to achieve?
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Post by sbtamu » Mon Nov 14, 2011 2:53 am

Like Funk said, there needs to be more detail.
Last edited by sbtamu on Mon Nov 14, 2011 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sorry for bad animation

http://www.youtube.com/user/sbtamu
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger » Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:28 am

Just to show how such a job needs to be calculated:

Let's say it's not really animation but just a sequence of still images. To fill 1 minute I would estimate about 15 drawings, at least, otherwise it would be dull. I don't know the quality of the storyboard (if such a thing exists), I fear the worst: just a list of written "expressions". So each drawing will take about 30 min from sketch to cleanup. Then the whole thing goes to the client who of course wants changes. In my experience 2/3 of the works gets changed, sometimes more than once. That will be another 15 drawings.

So we've already used 15 hrs of work, and I've not even included time for mailing or on the phone. That's still just 12 € per hour.

When I said "at least 1000.- €" I mean it, and I don't think it's asking for too much. And don't forget the 4% fee PayPal takes from that, or the taxes I pay.
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Re: [PAID] Doodle style animation project

Post by SvenFoster » Mon Nov 14, 2011 10:43 am

mr_projects wrote: - Budget is $250 paid in full upfront

Ahmad
Spend your $250 and buy this
http://anime.smithmicro.com/buy.html

DELETED: lots of insensitive words

EDIT: Grumpy monday morning attitude rightly pointed out by cucumihai. sorry and good luck
Last edited by SvenFoster on Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
--Sven
What *if* the Hokey cokey *is* what its all about?
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Post by cucumihai » Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:41 am

I don't want to be rude or anything but everytime someone posted a job offer in this section of the forum, you guys, the proffessionals (i'm not sarcastic ,you know your animations) bring up the money problem and give suggestions and often you are rude to the guy that offered the job.
This is how i see it: Not everyone has thousands of dollars or euros and if someone has a job offer then fine, if the money they pay is next to nothing then no one will help him, you don't have to tell the guy what money you want and speak for everyone.
There are coutries other than yours in which $250 for that kind of animation is decent
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger » Mon Nov 14, 2011 11:55 am

I think it's important to educate people. Very often they don't have any idea about how much work it actually is they ask for. And if I don't comment, others see those numbers and think that's the standard, which means that we will all suffer from being under-payed in the end.

And yes, 250$ might be a big sum elsewhere in the world. But I live here, and I have to pay my rent and taxes here. What do you think will happen if all people try to move to those places where life is cheaper (at the moment)?

As long as nothing different is indicated I judge all offers here as being located in Europe or Northern America, which means certain minimum wages.
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Rhoel
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Post by Rhoel » Mon Nov 14, 2011 12:49 pm

slowtiger wrote:What do you think will happen if all people try to move to those places where life is cheaper (at the moment)?
Like me :-)

Sending work to the far east is not without its own unique problems:
In Cambodia our costs are 1/4 of Europe. That said, we do not have the pool of talent (at the moment). But we're working on that, its getting better.

The Nightmares:
Four years ago, I was involved with development work which was sent to India - they promised the best kit and crew; we even flew a guy out to check the facility to make sure it existed: We awarded them the work and in return, we had lots of reports and helpful comments highlighting the progress. The day their guy was supposed to fly out, he mentioned (from the departure lounge) that not all the work was complete. When pressed on how much of our pilot work was complete, we discovered none of it, he wanted to show us similar work. I pulled his flight and he didn't get on the plane ... we lost all the money we sent them (including the canceled flight) and never saw any final output they were contracted to complete.

The lesson learned?
Pushing work to third world cheap countries is risky. By contrast, your 3000 euros per minute usually gets you professionalism.

How not to get your fingers burned?
The secret of commissioning 3rd world outsourcing is to send one of your own staff out to monitor things. They are there to help the locals with translations and general technical/production issues, and to be your eyes and ears, to report back any discrepancies between where the production staff say they are, and actually are: Asians hate to tell you bad news as it might upset you - so to an Asian mindset, saying everything is hunky-dory when in reality chaos reigns, is better than causing you stress by saying its all gone pear-shaped.

I have been out here 7 years now and I'm beginning to get good at reading the hidden meaning of "everything okay". But every now and then, someone pulls a completely new one out of the bag and surprises you. Which is why I like living here so much.

Rhoel
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger » Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:23 pm

The animation studio I worked with in the 90's at that time already started to set up a partnership with a taiwanese studio. They did it the right way from the beginning: sending their own people as supervisors to Taiwan. Now, 20 yrs later, they have a well-established production line and get quality results. Unfortunately this means that this studio doesn't offer any animation jobs in Berlin any more, they only do pre- and post production work here for 10 yrs now.
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Post by mr_projects » Mon Nov 14, 2011 1:43 pm

Thanks, but I decided to do it myself as whats required is very simple. Job post cancelled

( Moderators can delete this thread if they want. )
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mimer
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Post by mimer » Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:44 am

no offence to anyone

$250 in min is okay for some ppl(not in western) already, maybe u can post yr link to a outsourcing site, like odesk

maybe my post is little late, i just find i can get job here :oops:

hope it help
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