Best Free Vector Graphics Software to Work with Moho?

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xmp333
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Best Free Vector Graphics Software to Work with Moho?

Post by xmp333 »

Hi,


I want to do my drawing in a vector graphics editor and export the results into Moho. I tried doing this with Inkscape via EPS, but it didn't work; Moho went through the motions of importing but nothing showed up. What free vector graphics editors can export to something Moho can use?


Thanks.
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heyvern
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Post by heyvern »

Hmm...

A free vector program?

Uh... a free vector program... to save eps... to import... into Moho?

Why exactly? If you don't own a program that does this right now... why not just draw in Moho?

Most people need this because they already have files in eps format.

I guess I am confused.

-Vern
xmp333
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Post by xmp333 »

heyvern wrote:Hmm...

A free vector program?

Uh... a free vector program... to save eps... to import... into Moho?

Why exactly? If you don't own a program that does this right now... why not just draw in Moho?

Most people need this because they already have files in eps format.

I guess I am confused.

-Vern
Moho's drawing facilities are poor. Moho is great at animation however, so an optimal situation would be to use a dedicated vector graphics editor to design what I need, then import it into Moho.

I don't need EPS, any vector graphics format Moho can recognize is fine with me.
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Víctor Paredes
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Post by Víctor Paredes »

i think that better than looking for another software, you should just draw with moho.
i don't think the drawing tools are bad, you must to accustom to them.
actually, i work with coreldraw, freehand and illustrator, and even so, for moho the better choice is moho.
xmp333
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Post by xmp333 »

selgin wrote:i think that better than looking for another software, you should just draw with moho.
i don't think the drawing tools are bad, you must to accustom to them.
actually, i work with coreldraw, freehand and illustrator, and even so, for moho the better choice is moho.
I've given it several weeks, and it hasn't gotten better. But then Moho is an animation package, so it's unfair to expect it to excel as a vector graphics editor. For this reason, I won't go into a list of all the problems I have with Moho's drawing system.
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jahnocli
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Post by jahnocli »

I agree with your comments about Moho's drawing tools -- adjusting those nodes is like arranging weights on a water bed. I use Xara Xtreme -- not free, but not expensive either...
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
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Nolan Scott
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Post by Nolan Scott »

Try this one, might be still available.

http://www.microsoft.com/products/expre ... links.aspx

Cheers
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Post by myles »

Expression is excellent. The 3.3 version Nolan pointed to (if it is still available) is labelled beta/preview, but it is as stable and usable as a commercial program (there is one non-working icon on the toolbar, but it wan't even there in version 3.2 and earlier versions so it's not any loss).

If you are going to be exporting to Moho, make sure all your lines are set to plain "PS Strokes" to get a reasonable number of points - by default Expression uses "Sk(eletal) strokes" which generate hundreds of points when exported to EPS/AI. Add line thickness variation in Moho, not Expression.

Myself, I'm reasonably happy drawing vector-based characters and other things in Moho (I like the complete point placement control), but other apps are sometimes good for backgrounds, props, and bitmap/raster character pieces.

Regards, Myles.
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger »

Of course there's need for an additional illustration program, at least as long as Moho doesn't support Bezier curves with their comfortable handles. I spent hours yesterday to just create some smooth, straight lines in Moho. Among the things I badly missed that moment were:
- a line drawing tool for straight lines, maybe one that creates a new point with every tip of the pen, with straight lines inbetween
- a tool to create additional points on an existing shape, without adding new line segments

Besides that, Moho saved my ass yesterday. The client wanted another version of the already finished logo, which meant another version of the animation as well - bigger, longer, in Quicktime instead as an animated GIF. Fine with me, I had the whole day to tinker with Moho and impress my workmates, including showing them 3D effects which they thought were only possible in Illustrator.

The whole thing looks very much like Flash, being graphical and without characters, but I doubt I could've done it in Flash that fast. Sorry, I can't show you anything right now. But here's one of the problems which had to be solved:

You have a background in one dark colour. You have a segmented white thick line in perspective, representing the middle of the road. Now make the lines approach you continuously, swaying left and right like seen from a drunken motorcycle driver.

How would you do this?
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Post by jeff »

For designing characters and so on, I have no problem with Moho as is, nice as it would be for the drawing to be more like in Flash.

The real problem I have is with some very simple shapes - for example a crescent moon shape which took a few seconds to create in Xara by simply using Booleans (I cut a circle shaped chunk from another circle) takes many many minutes to create in Moho and then still tends to look a bit wonky. Importing from Xara is not a solution because of the well discussed problems with importing bezier-created shapes.

Booleans....now there's a future request.

Jeff
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jahnocli
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Post by jahnocli »

slowtiger wrote:How would you do this?
In Flash? Masking.
You can't have everything. Where would you put it?
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heyvern
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Post by heyvern »

slowtiger wrote:- a line drawing tool for straight lines, maybe one that creates a new point with every tip of the pen, with straight lines inbetween
- a tool to create additional points on an existing shape, without adding new line segments
Uh... there is a script in the script menu under Draw called Split Curve. This does what it says... adds points without messing up the shape.

You can draw straight line shapes by clicking the Sharp Corners checkbox in the add point tool... not sure if that's what you meant.

I slapped this together in about 30 minutes using particles for the road lines:

http://www.lowrestv.com/moho_stuff/moon.mov

The moon is just two circles and the split curve script set for 2. Break some points... connect... less then a minute. Not wonky in the least.
(the moon is "one shape"... hard to see against black.)

--------------

All of these complaints about Moho's drawing tools are... valid to a degree... but there is also the aspect of taking time to learn your tools.

Took me a while to learn the tools in Moho. Quite unique and very different from AI.

Those of you who insist on finding something else to get the work done... are just adding many extra steps to the creation process.

Importing EPS or AI into Moho... what you end up with is still... Moho. All these import options are doing is adding a bazillion extra points to your Moho vectors.... which doesn't make animating easier... makes it harder.

Ultimately the best way to use Moho is to learn the tools.

;)

-vern
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Post by jeff »

Nice little demo movie, Vern.

I think there's a fine line between unfair griping and legitimate cause for dissatisfaction. For instance, whilst it's true as you say that it is very simple to add extra points with the Split Curve tool, it is also true that if the user tries to add their own arbitary points (a reasonable desire) to, say, a circle, the lovely circle suddenly looks very un-circle like.

I think you're overlooking the fact that we may not all be as smart as you!

Jeff
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heyvern
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Post by heyvern »

Funny... I don't think of myself as smarter than anyone else... but thanks for the compliment.

Here's another tip:

I leave dangly vectors off the ends of connections so I can adjust the curves at "corners" Instead of peaking points. You know how the curve isn't quite right on peaked corners sometimes?

The half moon is actually two connected vectors with "danglies" off the tips. I was able to maintain the pefect circular curvature this way.

I use the split curve and that technique all the time for a sort of "poor mans" merge shape, or boolean type... thingy. Not as easy as "clicking a button"... but... don't have the button... not going to wait for the button. will be happy when the button appears of course.

if drawn in AI or other similar applications and imported you won't learn the nature of Moho curves... and can't discover these little tricks. Even imported AI files still have those "corner curve" issues.

-vern
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slowtiger
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Post by slowtiger »

I will not use a script to do simple stuff like adding points which should be possible to do with the tip of a pen, since this is standard behaviour of all vector programs I know.

There's a reason why FreeHand and Illustrator survived a decade: they were designed in a user-friendly way - not everywhere, mind you, but the important tools were always easy to use. You really can't simplify their usage any further, which is always a sure sign of good design. Just count the steps:
(Freehand)
- select shape
- change tool (keyboard shortcut)
- click - the additional point is part of the shape

(Moho)
- select a part of the shape
- go into the menu, drop down
- enter a number
- return - the additional point is part of the shape

One step too much, not to mention the nuisance to leave your work area in order to dive into a submenu. If you are interested in general discussion of userfriendliness of software, read Jacob Nielsen and other specialists in the field.

You may call this a minor difference, I call it important because hurdles like that sum up. It is like having to stick the handle into the head every time before I can use my hammer. Power users decide upon things like this wether they buy or drop a program, because every step counts in the workflow.
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